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Northcott
09-10-2007, 07:41 AM
The summary of this study seems to be: the number of people who are predisposed to speed is low, and the number of people with a gene that blocks full development of speed is high, therefore evolution favours endurance running.

Is it just me, or does this seem like somewhat of a stretch? When the span of physical activities of our species is considered, the importance of combat and/or sport in various societies throughout history, and the role of speed in the success of these (because fast-twitch fibers affect much more than how you run, they affect your punching speed, the amount of force you can exert in lifting a weight, etc) -- it seems counter-intuitive to say that those who achieve greatly are being bred out.

It strikes me as being akin to saying that because physical beauty (in an extreme) is such a rare trait that we're evolving past it, or have left it behind. There's something off about using rarity of occurance as the root of a theory -- if I'm reading this correctly.

Additionally, there's the notion of our own history to examine: the claim is that this shift away from speed and toward endurance -- if indeed such a shift has really occured -- has happened only recently in human evolutionary history. Yet when you look at the past couple thousand years of our history, for the most part travel became very limited once domestication of livestock and crops became commonplace. What need is there for long-distance endurance running when people make little to no use of that ability? If such a need existed, it would be more valuable in pre-agricultural times when a nomadic lifestyle may have existed without the aid of horses or other riding and pack animals to depend upon. Yet even then hunting would be more favourable for those who are capable of generating greater speed and power, much like other predatory animals.

So let's open this up, folks. :) It may make for an interesting discussion.


http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/afp/070909/health/health_biotech_sports_1

Born to run: Gene clue to athletic endurance
Sun Sep 9, 1:31 PM

PARIS (AFP) - If you were a prehistoric human, would you prefer to able to sprint very fast for short distances? Or to jog comfortably for kilometres (miles)?

That's one of the questions thrown up by the so-called "gene for speed," known as ACTN3.

One of the most intriguing genes discovered, ACTN3 encodes a protein that governs metabolism in "fast twitch" muscle fibres, which generate force at high speed.

Around 18 percent of the world's population has a truncated variant of the gene which blocks this protein. The stubby variant, called R577X, is common among successful endurance athletes, previous research has found.

On the other hand, elite sprinters, who need explosive speed, are likelier to have the reverse -- a functioning variant of ACTN3.

Keen to find out more, researchers led by Kathryn North, a professor at the Children's Hospital at Westmead, in Sydney, Australia, created a batch of mice that had been engineered to lack ACTN3.

The "knockout" mice and ordinary mice with a functioning ACTN3 gene were put on a motorised treadmill, which spun ever faster until the luckless rodents were exhausted.

The easy winners in this endurance test were the knockout mice, which were able to run on average a third further than their counterparts.

The apparent reason for this: the loss of ACNT3's protein was compensated by a different protein, called alpha-actinin-2, which shifted muscle metabolism towards a smoother, more efficient, aerobic pathway.

As a result, fast-twitch leg muscles could be contracted again and again, without tiring.

North's team also looked through genetic profiles from individuals of European and East Asian descent and found that there was remarkably little sign of mutation in the wider stretch of genetic code in the vicinity of R577X.

Such similarity is a telltale sign of what evolutionary experts call positive selection. Genes which help the fight for survival get lastingly incorporated in the human genome, whereas those that encumber it get weeded out.

In other words, the ability to run longer distances became a preferential trait that became incorporated into a wide swathe of Homo sapiens.

If so, the incorporation happened recently, on the long scale of human history.

According to North's calculations, R577X took root among populations in central Europe around 15,000 years ago and in East Asia around 33,000 years ago.

The variant has not been incorporated in all of us, either because so little time has elapsed for this to happen or is being countered by selective pressures in favour of other genes, they speculate.

The study is published on Sunday in the specialist journal Nature Genetics.

Varaj
09-10-2007, 08:12 AM
They aren't using rarity to show evolutionary selection but lack of mutation .

North's team also looked through genetic profiles from individuals of European and East Asian descent and found that there was remarkably little sign of mutation in the wider stretch of genetic code in the vicinity of R577X.

Such similarity is a telltale sign of what evolutionary experts call positive selection. Genes which help the fight for survival get lastingly incorporated in the human genome, whereas those that encumber it get weeded out.

In other words, the ability to run longer distances became a preferential trait that became incorporated into a wide swathe of Homo sapiens.

Northcott
09-10-2007, 09:06 AM
I'll admit to being brain-fried today -- feeling completely drained -- so perhaps that's why I'm just not seeing the difference. Doesn't the above quote amount to "there is stability in the (distance) gene over an extended period of time, so it becomes the evolutionary standard"?

Varaj
09-10-2007, 09:36 AM
I'll admit to being brain-fried today -- feeling completely drained -- so perhaps that's why I'm just not seeing the difference. Doesn't the above quote amount to "there is stability in the (distance) gene over an extended period of time, so it becomes the evolutionary standard"?

Nope it means that the gene has recently become common, there has been a change that has made the gene more likely to be adapted. If it was a regular gene that was around for a long time more variation in the gene would be seen.

The Winslow
09-10-2007, 09:54 AM
The summary of this study seems to be: the number of people who are predisposed to speed is low, and the number of people with a gene that blocks full development of speed is high, therefore evolution favoured endurance running.

Fixed.

Northcott
09-10-2007, 11:42 AM
Nope it means that the gene has recently become common, there has been a change that has made the gene more likely to be adapted. If it was a regular gene that was around for a long time more variation in the gene would be seen.


Yeah, I'm definitely brain-fried today. Funny how fatigue can affect cognitive abilities.

Still, and this may be the brain-fog talking, it seems to me that the assertation/reasoning of the history of it seems a bit wonky. If anything, I'd think that the development of agrarian cultures, followed by our current excercise-deficient technological society, would have had a different effect.

Varaj
09-10-2007, 12:33 PM
Yeah, I'm definitely brain-fried today. Funny how fatigue can affect cognitive abilities.

Still, and this may be the brain-fog talking, it seems to me that the assertation/reasoning of the history of it seems a bit wonky. If anything, I'd think that the development of agrarian cultures, followed by our current excercise-deficient technological society, would have had a different effect.

The time frame estimated seems to match the move to agrarian societies which makes sense to me. Working the fields is long, slow hard work.

doc
09-10-2007, 12:37 PM
While Endurance running is needed to run down prey, run from predators and go to war before the horse.

Janos
09-10-2007, 12:47 PM
So basically, only a few very rare people are genetically linked into the Speed Force?

doc
09-10-2007, 12:51 PM
Thier the Running Backs (Darren McFadden !!!), sprinters and beer stealers of the world. Or at least have the potential.

Northcott
09-10-2007, 03:01 PM
The time frame estimated seems to match the move to agrarian societies which makes sense to me. Working the fields is long, slow hard work.

Very true. I was stuck in the mental rut of contemplating the locomotive implications of it: how fast we move, how far, etc. In eras of restricted travel, that seemed odd. In terms of work capacity, it makes sense.

It also explains why genes for speed continue to not only exist, but perhaps to provide impetus for desirable mates: muscle fibres that deal with speed not only generate more power, but may have greater potential for hypertrophy (growth), leading to what some consider a more asthetically appealing physique. Given that agrarian societies tended to have warrior castes of one sort or another watching/ruling over them, and the value of... hmmmm. Thought's drifting before I can complete it. I hate days like this.

Anyway, the differing requirements of sections of society may have rewarded that (speed) variant enough to not merely preserve it, but perhaps even to make it a desireable trait. Given the accolades we bestow upon athletes and warriors throughout history and in modern times, it makes for some interesting thinking.

So basically, only a few very rare people are genetically linked into the Speed Force?

Heh! Thinking about buying some red tights?

While Endurance running is needed to run down prey, run from predators and go to war before the horse.

Speed would be required for all of the above, Doc. In terms of endurance ability, we're a pretty shoddy animal... though extreme specimens of human speed can actually match or exceed race horses in very short races. We've got excellent accelleration, being able to reach top speed in just a few steps. Many predatory animals are geared toward short bursts of speed rather than long-term endurance. Track the prey, hide, wait for it to get near or sneak up on it, depend on surprise and speed to take it down.

Same with escaping predators. It doesn't matter jack shit if you can run a marathon if that sucker bags n' tags you four steps into the race.

The Winslow
09-10-2007, 03:27 PM
I remember reading an article showing how (reasonably athletic) humans had a higher average speed than antelopes, on a scale of a whole day. Walk toward your prey, follow its tracks. Walk tirelessly. Sure, the prey runs faster than you, but it doesn't run for a long time. It'll stop, walk again, graze again, and you'll catch up. It'll get startled, run again, stop again, and you'll catch it up again. Until it's too exhausted to continue running fast enough to escape you when you show up.

Varaj
09-10-2007, 03:38 PM
Kind of neat reading
http://discovermagazine.com/2006/may/tramps-like-us
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persistence_hunting

Northcott
09-11-2007, 10:41 AM
I'm glad I posted this. It's provoked some interesting chit-chat. :)