Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?!

[Brynja]

OK I am breaking my personal rule of pretending LoP doesn't exist but this shit was beyond the fucking pale.

http://www.circvsmaximvs.com/showpost.php?p=439844&postcount=534


Real fucking class right there.


That shit set my blood on fire. The twat defends utter retards and is a callous cunt about rape.


Die in a fire.


That is all.

[EhtoZed]

That's what I've been saying!

[Brynja]

Well man consider this your vindication.

[Varaj]

Somebody will have to quote since I don't have an account there.

[Atropine Mama]

Bratt apparently posted her chanimail vibrator pics in the sex forum of CM, a mod deleted them, and she reposted a link to the pictures on HO. Here are the pertinent drama posts from the thread.

Bratt... are you actually cross-board rep/attention-whoring with pictures of your titties? I've got to say, that's a new low. Girl, I hope you realize that you're better than this someday. You're worth so much more than the kind of attention you'll get from crap like this.

First off HO doesn't have rep. Secondly the pictures are of a toy that was made by a fellow NTLer for me. And finally I see nothing wrong with the female form. I'm not ashamed of my body and I don't think any woman should be.

I recommend putting me on ignore if you can't handle me. Honestly, I have no qualms with you. We are just two very different women. I'm not going to mold myself into someone you want me to be.

That maybe so but this might come pretty close to the 'no porn' rule here.

The female body *is* amazing and I believe that women that want to show it off should. However, I also feel there's a time and place for it... and that it should be done for some purpose. And, yet, people that have seen the pics (I have not and do not care to) have described them as "pathetic" and "disgusting." That reaction, to me, oozes a kind of purposeless sadness that I can't even quantify.

And so, for that reason, I question why you would want people *here* looking at them. The most obvious reason is to get people to validate you and pay attention to you... and I feel that that is not a very good purpose to expose yourself like that.

So let me get this straight. It's ok for Reveal to post pics of himself because he's a man and it's ok to attention whore that way but it isn't ok for any female member to do the same?

As for pathetic and disgusting, you have no fucking clue do you? You haven't seen the pictures. They are very tasteful. Furthermore the people who are saying "shit" behind the scenes are the ones who never liked me to begin with so I'm not going to lose any fucking sleep over it.

I don't know what to say about all of this. I posted a picture of myself in a bra a year ago. Not sure what people thought of that, but I was pleased, since I rarely take a good picture and I thought that one was tasteful.

I posted that for my own ego, and I was really happy with the compliments I got. (and even happier that no high drama ensued). But I'll tell you what, I wouldn't post that pic in any sort of "Rate A Circvs Freak" thread. Like I said before, it's fun to rate the immortals, but for the love of god don't turn that magnifying glass on me.

I think anyone is free to post what they like, but there are a million shades of "taste", and if you post your pic online, be prepared for people to tell you that they find it distasteful.

The link shows more than a bra, LB, and yes it's all a matter of people's taste as well.

Wait... did you just attempt to divert the attention TO someone else?! That's a first.

There's a quintessential difference between you an reveal. Anything reveal has posted was for sheer entertainment. Teh Funney, as it were. While the pics you have posted may, in some circles, be interpreted as Teh Funney, you did not do it to be funny.

And, really, I don't think I understand WHY you do it. But, then, I'm just not the kind of girl that needs that kind of validation.

With that, I'm out of this discussion. But, I would ask that you really think about the reason you decided to post about the pics over here/invite CMers to look at you. Because I cannot fathom a reasonable answer to that question no matter how I try.

I was talking about the pics I could see; I ain't following no link, now.

Um...reveal didn't post pictures of himself that could be classified as porn. His pictures are funny and beefcake (ala Eric Cartman), not an attempt at something sexual or a statement about the human form.

I didn't either. BTW DG welcome to my ignore. You are the first ever to make it that far. Congrats.

Fine by me. You've been on mine for a good long time. Really, I only take you off when people PM me "OMG DID YOU SEE WHAT BRATT DID?! LOLZ! SHE'S SO PATHETIC!!" messages. Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at it) it happens frequently.

That's what I was talking about. If you post such personal images, someone might not like them. You posted them as a "Rate-A" thread, for pete's sake. Did you expect nothing but praise? Heck, there are models and actresses getting the lackadaisical "nah, she's too skinny/fat/short/blond/brunette" opines by our esteemed, silly panel.

And being that this messageboard is built on free-flowing, uncensored opinion, I'm surprised at your reaction to any negativity. I mean, what's the difference between getting bad feedback based on ethics, or esthetics? Not a damned thing.

Okay...so in an effort to explain the difference between reveal's cheesecake photos and Bratt's photos, I tried to go to the link and can't view them and tried to look at the Rate a Hottie thread and the pics have been removed. WTF?

Looks like someone didn't get the reaction they had hoped.

Okay...looked at your pictures. That qualifies as porn. That's not embracing the beauty of the human form or glorifying your femininity. That's a cry for attention...and a sad one at that.

Oh you're talking about the NTL ones. I wasn't talking about those. But hey speculate all you like.

NTL ones? I looked on HO. Those were...pornographic...and disturbing.

I think I've got $200 here if you wanna pony up pics too, Liz.

That's the going rate, right?

Now, I admit that I can - at times - be a little trashy. It's my bike-mom upbringing. But. Come on. Do you honestly think I'm that skanky?

Will you all stop quoting her. DangerGirl quit taking your rape frustrations out on me you stupid cunt!

What the fuck. You're not drunk now, are you? I know you're not. Knock it the fuck off already. It's not cute and it's not funny.

Please, no one quote me! I wouldn't want Bratt to have to be exposed to the illogical ramblings of a total bitchcake, but... I do just need to say:

I've gone through a lot of therapy to accept the fact that I was raped. I'm comfortable with my past and my body. I don't need to post naked pictures of myself on the 'net to *prove* that I'm comfortable with my body or validate some insecurity I have with my sexual history.

You're temporarily off ignore until you can learn when to shut the fuck up, you stupid insignificant little cunt.

Apparently you need a hell of a lot more because you sure as fuck haven't gotten over anything. You don't have the right to look down your nose at other people for expressing their sexuality. Not only am I not insecure about my body, but I see no reason I shouldn't show it off. If I want to post pictures of myself to a website, who the fuck are you to tell me I shouldn't? You're just a fucking whiny little attention whore who seeks validation by teasing men and never coming up with the goods.

Now fuck off and die, you vapid jealous little cunt.

I get it now. You are drunk again (hair of the dog), you're displeased that no one reacted well to your beaver shots, and now you're going for the Biggest Bitch On CM silly little poll in the Self-Flagellation because, well - let's face it - what else do you have going for yourself?

Oh, and I'm going to take a wild stab and guess that the word cunt makes women like DG and I chuckle. In fact, I'm saying it as I type. CUNTCUNTCUNTCUNT.

Ah. Breath of fresh air.

When it comes right down to it, Bratt, I'm not telling you to *not* post pictures of your cooter. In fact, if that's your particular idiom, I think you *should* post pictures. My question to you was: Why are you posting the link HERE when so many people here at CM apparently find the pictures to be disgusting and sad? Why are you attracting the attention of the people on CM when we have a no porn rule? What drives you to desire this kind of attention?

Also, I find the fact that you are neg-repping me for not getting over the fact that I was raped incredibly confusing. YOU brought up the fact that I was raped. Not me. I defended myself and said that I've gotten over it... in fact, what I consider the "last leg" of my personal quest to be comfortable with the fact that I was raped was sharing my story with other women and having other women share their stories with me. I have found many of those women here at CM. It's been a huge help. But, right now, that's neither here nor there because it has absolutely *nothing* to do with the issue at hand. You were just hoping to push my buttons and really piss me off... and that's just not going to happen because I'm not pissed off at all. I'm just concerned about your self esteem and mental stability.

Obviously, I've hit a sore spot for you as you have not answered a single question I have posed to you. Instead, you have taken it upon yourself to drum up memories of the most painful experience in *my* life and call me a cunt in order to divert the attention from the issue. It's pretty entertaining, but mostly it is just sad.

Please, Bratt, do some soul searching to figure out why the hell your self esteem is so low that, when questioned about your actions, you can't develop a legitimate response outside of telling me to die.

The only ones who seem to find it disgusting are a bunch of self righteous bitches who think it's acceptable to look down their noses at people. Fuck you. You can take your snobbery and shove it up your ass.

Is it posted here? I thought this was a messageboard for adults. I'm fine with sharing them, my husband is fine with sharing them, so what the fuck is it to you? I happen to think they turned out extremely well, which is the reason I chose to share. Why do you feel the need to comment? Are you feeling threatened? Insecure? These are your self esteem issues, not mine.

No other women are engaged in this behavior? What's up with the lingerie/pillow fight thread during Gen Con? Why would the women lead the guys on like that? Teasing is OK, but showing a bit of yourself is going too far?

My self esteem and mental stability are just fine. Keep your concern to yourself, I'm not interested in it. In fact, this isn't about concern, it's about you and your hangups. Stop projecting them upon me.

Deal with it. You thinking its your job to nanny this site is obviously coming from somewhere. Could it possibly be that you think that to show sexy pictures of myself is to invite rape? I deal with a lot of people, not just online, and my gut tells me that this is coming back to your own victimization. Again, stop projecting your issues on me.

You've got it backwards, little girl. Grow up.

Ah... Me thinks someone doesn't know the meaning of tongue-in-cheek and how the men in this place 'get it'.

Some of us don't need the internet to validate our existence and scream out "LOVE ME!"

YOUR the one who strung Aeson along to whore out attention from your husband. Aeson is not the only one to blame here. It takes two to tango and you went willingly to play your ever popular "poor me" scenario. But that's okay... it seems fine for you to poke fun at someone who was a victim of rape but heaven forbid someone else take a stab at your medical problems.

Pot meet Kettle, you fucking pathetic whiney cuntrag.

Bratt. Really, there's no graceful way to end this argument. You believe one thing and I believe another. In the end, it likely has nothing to do with issues that either of us have on a personal level. Instead, it has to do with the fact that you are comfortable being a spectacle and I am uncomfortable seeing women make a spectacle of themselves. In other words, you and I simply have different taste and different morals... and those differences are so severe that it causes us to judge one another.

I'm a prude and so I see your actions as a skanky cry for help. You are not a prude and so you see your actions as liberating and beautiful. Moreover, you see me as an overprotective nanny type because I am not comfortable with your actions. There's not a lot of middle ground there and neither of us is going to convince the other that her beliefs are better or worse.

When it comes right down to it, we're both attention whores. I would argue that my attention whoring is slightly less, um, boisterous. But, there's no doubt we both engage in it.

So... whatevs. I know that I'm not projecting anything on you. And you know that you're confident with your body and enjoy the kind of attention that comes from showing your body off. Additionally, you must find something personally satisfying by engaging in exhibitionism. So, I'm just going to drop it because I'm not going to convince you and you're not going to convince me.

I have to say, bringing up the rape thing seems like hitting way below the belt, to me.

Bu-bye, all respect for Bratt.

And I just checked DangerGirl's rep. This, Bratt -

You're not the only one who's been raped. Get over it.
is just disgusting. You should be ashamed of yourself.

Good grief.

Now, please, (Bratt) shut the hell up. I don't give a shit if you post pictures of your tits here or there or everywhere, but dredging up extremely painful memories just because someone doesn't like the fact that you post pictures on a message board is low, even for you. And that's saying a lot.

Almost every post you make is a cry for attention. You've been in/started rep clubs. You let your husband believe Aeson was stalking you because it meant he paid attention to you. You crave validation and, when you can't get it from your husband, you seek it out elsewhere. And when people tell you the truth, you get mean and vindictive, only to come crawling back later and saying you're sorry. It happens every single time.

I used to like you, Bratt/LoP, I really did. But your behavior lately, with the Aeson fiasco, getting banned from NTL, and now this has really made me lose the respect I had for you. It was obvious to anyone that you craved attention but I never honestly knew the lengths you'd go to get it until now.

It saddens me to know this, it really does, because there are times you can be really nice and caring. But nothing nice and caring can make up for the fact that you just told a woman who has been raped that she needs to get over it and that she's "not the only one who has been raped". You have absolutely no right to be self righteous.

What the fucking hell.

I'm done with the bashing back to the sex talk. I don't have any sex stuff to add because of I have a headache.

Bratt, that was poorly played...poorly played, indeed. I don't have much else to add without it reading like a paraphrased version of reveal's post, so just go read that one again.

Actually it was the truth. I'm finally getting some relief from the pain so I'll give you a serious post for the moment.

DangerGirl I stepped way over the line. I'm for that I'm truly sorry. I don't expect you to accept the apology but for what it's worth I truly mean it. The whole rape comment shouldn't have been made. I fucked up. This is not me. I suppose for the day I kind of slipped into Lady of Pain mode but that still doesn't excuse my behavior. I haven't even been this cold and mean to Kastil. I'm not going to continue this behavior for this point on. It isn't worth the time and drama.

For the rest of you, I want to state my opinion and you don't have to like it one way or another. I see a lot of double standards going on around here but then I suppose that happens in the real world as well. I have am very open about my sexuality and that is why I like this forum because that is what it is for. So when I got jumped down on for actually posting a link to something that had to do with that, I was very angered. It's not like I posted this out in the general forum for repwhoring, attention whoring or what every kind of whoring you want to call it. It's called I want to show other mothers out there who may not be feeling all that sexy that they can still be sexy not matter what the shape of their body is. I've had 4 kids in the last 5yrs years and been through countless surgeries. I feel good for once and damn it I wanted to do something that made me feel good. I know that it isn't for everyone and that's fine. That's what makes us all individuals.

So I think that about covers.

I really can't read anything past this post (Bratt's rape insult) right now. That is a horrifically horrible thing to say to anyone, and ESPECIALLY someone's who been raped. Grow up.

I suppose the counseling I received was very helpful and I should be considered lucky. But read my apology. Maybe that will make some sense as to why I blew up the way I did.

With respect Bratt, this is your A typical behavior. Some disagrees with you and you go ape shit. You make nice when the tide is drowning you and then after it's cooled down, you'll probably start again.

As far as the pictures.... there is a difference between what some find sexy and what some find pornographic. Just your entitled to your opinions, so is everyone else in this place and they're not always going to be in line with what you want to hear. I'm n ot ashamed of my body and my husband takes pics but when you've got a 13 year old, it's not something you keep around.

Bratt - While it is good that you admitted to stepping over the line it is not cool to blame it on your pain. Pain does not cause you to say hurtful things to people. You do that yourself. Just stand up for it and admit it and not blame it on your pain. I have been in a huge amount of pain before and it did not give me the right to say whatever I wanted to and think I would get away with it.

I know these comments might upset you but you really did cross a line that should NEVER be crossed.

I'm not blaming it on the pain. I said the pain may have been part of the reason I slipped back into Lady of Pain mode. I take full responsibility for my actions here today. I don't expect anyone to change their views for what I have said.

Well, apparently you think it's funny to watch someone hurt and to inflict that hurt yourself. Calling someone a "vapid jealous little cunt" and bringing up rape when you know they've been hurt in the past? You really are a total and consummate bitch.

No apology that you give now or in the future can ever change my opinion of you. If you didn't like what DG was saying about your pics, then argue about the damn pics and don't turn the argument back on her by bring up painful memories.

(Your apology) Didn't clear up a damn thing for me. Personally, I think Liz is an all-around wonderful person to apologize like she did and use such great diplomacy to settle this argument. One day, I hope to be more like her. For now, though, I'll settle for being petty and totally pissed off at you.

DG was brave enough to speak of her rape in the past and Bratt was vicious enough to attempt to use that as ammunition during an argument. There's a lot to be learned about human interaction in it. At least there is for me.

Which brings me around to Bratt, who has previously been nothing but friendly to me in my time here. However, I can't look past what I view as a malicious attempt to publically hurt someone else's feelings. Bratt has apologized for this, but I still feel the need to limit and/or eliminate interaction with her. I'm just disturbed and angered by her words.

Am I a judgmental hypocrit for this?

The more things change, the more they stay the same. You have every right to be disturbed. Whether you want to overlook this and maintain communication with her is up to you, obviously, but be aware that this is not an isolated incident and it will happen again.

[Maynard G. Krebs]

Jesus fuck. :rolleyes:

[Brynja]

Because saying "oh tee he hee i was raped too!"

makes its is magically ok.


Cunt needs to die in a fire, I will say again!

[Atropine Mama]

Jesus fuck. :rolleyes:

Can ya give us a little plus or minus on the whole Jesus fuck thing so we know which way Jesus is fucking? Can't tell what you're commenting on. :confused:

[Cyragnome]

Wow...just wow.

<speechless at the depths the Drader's plumb*>





*I include both based on some comments I've heard about on "their" board

[Brynja]

I know Cyra and normally I steer clear of the Berdrader Triangle but that shit just exploded my head.

[TiQuinn]

What does it say? I can't access it. :)

[Brynja]

it is quoted for you :D

[TiQuinn]

it is quoted for you :D

Durrrrrrrrr. :o

[bunny]

I can't believe she called Liz vapid while trying to defend posting pics of herself in a porn free board just to get more rep points. It's possible that she simply doesn't understand the meaning of the word but... gah. Maybe while she's looking it up she should look up hypocrit.


She's made some pretty lousy moves on the boards over the years, but this is an alltime low.

[Lisa Nadazdy]

All I can say is.... wow.:eye-popping:

[Janos]

Yup, that was a new low even for Bratt. DangerGirl handled it like a class act.

[Brynja]

I have no idea who most of those women were (save a few) but still.

[Maynard G. Krebs]

Can ya give us a little plus or minus on the whole Jesus fuck thing so we know which way Jesus is fucking? Can't tell what you're commenting on. :confused:
Well, I know the Draders more by reputation than actual content.
Now I've seen some content, and I can see that it lives up to reputation.

Talk about being offended, denying being offended, then hugely overreacting, then pussyfooting, then backpedaling.

It's really kind of sad.

[TiQuinn]

Wow, all that's missing from that thread is NZorak jumping into the middle to cuss out DangerGirl while completely excusing everything that his wife did.

Those two are seriously fucked up individuals.

[Brynja]

And they have crotch droppings all their own

[Lisa Nadazdy]

No, actually, I will say something- Bratt is a fucking cocknugget that should have been slowly drowned at birth.

[Cyragnome]

Wow, all that's missing from that thread is NZorak jumping into the middle to cuss out DangerGirl while completely excusing everything that his wife did.

Those two are seriously fucked up individuals.
That's pretty much what he did on their board (following a link on CM).

[Maynard G. Krebs]

Does DangerGirl post here? Because if she does she is deserving of some serious rep for not only not rising to the bait, but for being judicious and even-handed in the face of some real fucking callousness.

[Brynja]

I don't think she does, no.

Is Danger Girl=Queenie D?

[Cyragnome]

I don't think she does, no.

Is Danger Girl=Queenie D?
Queenie is one person, QueenD/QueenSnufflupagus ;) /QueenDoppleopolis are another...the latter being DangerGirl!

[SHARK]

Greetings!

Goddamn...what is LOP's problem with DangerGirl? I mean, how does their different opinions on the appropriateness of *nudity/exhibitionism*--have *ANYTHING* to do with DangerGirl being raped, and LOP somehow feeling just fucking fine making fun of DangerGirl, and saying such hateful, cruel, FUCKING CUNT BITCH things to her?

Geez, it just boggles my mind at how hateful, insensitive, arrogant, disrespectful people can be. And most of the time, it isn't in response to some horrible or jackass attack--most of the time it's over some of the most petty, insignificant things.

What's with the whole "Attention Whore" competition between all of these women? Are these women that pathetic and shallow to feel the need to get some kind of constant ego-stroking attention on fucking an ONLINE MESSAGEBOARD?????

For Christ's sake, I barely have time to hang out to actually talk to friends and participate in some meaningful conversations--I can't imagine having so much free time and so little to do in my life that I need to spend time stoking the coals of stupid attention whore competition threads? My fucking god!!! And to think these women are married, and usually have kids, (I think most of them have jobs don't they?)--or am I just tilting at windmills here? Are there really trailer-park women that have nothing better to do in their lives than orchestrate these kinds of drama fests?

LOP just...geez fuck...she *apologised*--but goddamn, after I read page after page of her shredding DangerGirl, rubbing her nose in it how she was raped, how she's a pathetic little cunt--wow, you know? I can't say a fucking apology covers it. No fucking way.

Just another thought. I wonder if LOP has ever slowed down and reflected on the strange phenomena that...in NTL, and now at CM...she has so many people--especially *WOMEN*--that hate her with a burning passion. And, I might add, LOP has somehow gotten people that ARE NOT CROSSBOARD MEMBERS--to feel the same grim, disgusting hate for her, and the same deep and pervasive contempt for her. There are lots of people on all of these boards that do not have nearly--fuck, not even in the same world--kind of social problems that LOP has had at NTL--and now CM. That's pretty pathetic.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

[Brynja]

I have to say in all my years on these boards she is truly the only person that repulses me. You hit it right on the head SHARK.

[Steampunk]

And *I* was accused of being a troublemaker...

[Brynja]

Well she is a huge trouble maker.

But this isnt about you- this is about what a cunt Bratt is- *hands you a program*

Here we go.

[Dawnstar]

I have to say that I spent some time talking to her on PM and I thought she was not all that bad but the comment about rape made me loss all respect for the woman. You never say something like that and coming from someone who said they were raped themselves, they should know better.

I already told Dangergirl that I thought she handled it much better than I would have.

[Steampunk]

Well she is a huge trouble maker.

But this isnt about you- this is about what a cunt Bratt is- *hands you a program*

Here we go.

I know, just making a general comment.

I'm staying away from her shit.

[keryn]

I have no idea who most of those women were (save a few) but still.

I'm me! Apparently, my actions in that thread got me banned from NZorak's new site (HO). I've never been banned from anything before. http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/4091/iconcool5lw.gif

Wow, all that's missing from that thread is NZorak jumping into the middle to cuss out DangerGirl while completely excusing everything that his wife did.

Those two are seriously fucked up individuals.

I'm sure he would have jumped in there, but he's the only person to actually be banned permanently from CM.
http://forum.gamestar.de/gspinboard/images/smilies/muhaha.gif

[Brynja]

It figures.

Maybe their message board will just end up being a read only feed of the two of them bickering.

[TiQuinn]

It figures.

Maybe their message board will just end up being a read only feed of the two of them bickering.


I doubt it. They need a stage and audience.

[Brynja]

but they will have one- if it is read only we can sit passively no?

[Lisa Nadazdy]

I've long been sick of their 'drama bombs' and wish the Draders would just drop off the net. Preferably on to some sharp rocks. I've got to really hate the constant attention whoring that 'Bratt' seems to have a sick obsession with.

Bratt, get a fucking life, you useless shitstain.

[Brynja]

Hmm well I am kinda Zen about it-

The sun rises in the east and shit like this always happens.

It just burned my cookies this time because of the topic she chose.

[Black Angel]

I have never really had a lot to do with either of these people, and this is just re-inforcing my happiness at such lack of interaction. Shark has put it very well.

[reveal]

I truly feel sorry for Aeson. He's in love, he's a moron, and she's got him wrapped around her little finger and telling him to dance. It's pathetic, actually. :(

[obryn]

That thread makes me sad.

-O

[Steampunk]

It goes way beyond making me sad. I never though even she would step THAT low. But, she has proven me wrong time and again, so why should now be any different?

[Martin]

It's like they're in a race to see who can be hated more.

Well, I'm done with the both of them. I found NZorak's reaction to Christopher absolutely reprehensible. LoP topped that and I don't even know DangerGirl. I won't register at their site and I rarely go to CM, so I'm Drader-free unless they register here.

[Brynja]

And thank god we are drader free here.

Besides if any shit gets stirred up, the General wont think twice.

[Scutisorex Shrewlord]

Well I have nothing to add. :(

[Northcott]

It's like they're in a race to see who can be hated more.

Well, I'm done with the both of them. I found NZorak's reaction to Christopher absolutely reprehensible. LoP topped that and I don't even know DangerGirl. I won't register at their site and I rarely go to CM, so I'm Drader-free unless they register here.

Dangergirl/Queen D's a down-to-earth kind of person. Class act. When she posted on NTL she's one of the ones, like yourself, Dr. A, and others, who I could always count on to conduct themselves with tact and good humour.

I think that the Drader's have finally spent the last bit of currency they had left with these communities they've dwelt among.

[Brynja]

I am inclined to agree with you Northcott. The thread was just so mindblowing callous of Bratt. It scares me a bit to think of how someone could be that way to folks.

[EhtoZed]

If she wasn't lying about leaving CM then we may be lucky enough to have this shit behind us. Fuck I'm tired of those two, they make me so fucking angry. And as a wonderful parting gift she left me a neg rep comment on NTL for mentioning her rape comment yesterday.

Whatever, I hope to god this is the last of it. The month after they were banned at NTL was like turning the clock back two years. It felt great to be truly comfortable in this community again.

[Ancalagon]

I'll paraphrase what I said there:

I thought that DangerGirl was a big harsh in her initial criticism, but LoP WAY over reacted. That's like shooting someone because they cut in front of you in a line for a movie ticket. Totally disproportionate, totally out of line.

Ancalagon

[BOZ]

Bratt apparently posted her chanimail vibrator pics in the sex forum of CM, a mod deleted them, and she reposted a link to the pictures on HO. Here are the pertinent drama posts from the thread.

man, that's fucked up.

looks like she turned all the women of CM against her in one swell foop.

[BOZ]

Wow, all that's missing from that thread is NZorak jumping into the middle to cuss out DangerGirl while completely excusing everything that his wife did.

either he didn't know it was going on, or he did and for once in his life he averted getting himself into trouble. :D

[BOZ]

I'm sure he would have jumped in there, but he's the only person to actually be banned permanently from CM.
http://forum.gamestar.de/gspinboard/images/smilies/muhaha.gif

oh yeah, that's the real reason. :)

[Lisa Nadazdy]

either he didn't know it was going on, or he did and for once in his life he averted getting himself into trouble. :D

Actually, it has more to do with the fact that he's been banned for life at Circvs Maximvs.

[BOZ]

see above post. :D

[BOZ]

oh yeah, and here's something i noticed. i don't think, on any message board ever, i've seen that many consecutive posts from women - at first i just thought, "eh, weird coincidence" but then as i saw what was going down, i realized that because she was saying some shit that was simply abhorrent to all women, and damn if that didn't bring them out of the woodwork to give her a good slapdown.

i don't know if she was drunk, or just too emotional to think straight, but i don't expect her to live that one down - did she just cross over the ArtQ infamy line? ;)

[Steampunk]

NZ did it, using her account.

http://www.circvsmaximvs.com/showthread.php?t=29885

[Lisa Nadazdy]

You know, I've never seen someone work so hard to have everybody hate him. Darrin needs to get a grip.

[Bones]

Darrin needs to get a grip.


Only grip he has is the grip on the next pile of shit he is going to fling.

[Keeper of Secrets]

It seems that NZ may be the real culprit. Based upon the language used, I was kind of suspicious to begin with.

[Scutisorex Shrewlord]

Now she's banned from CM too.

[SHARK]

Greetings!

I found these comments on HO.

Quote LOP:
To answer this http://www.circvsmaximvs.com/showthread.php?t=29885

I let NZ have my account at CM for the day. I didn't even know about DG rape incident until the after math of the drama after I logged back in. I will not be going back to CM. NZ thought it would be a funny way to get back at her for dissing on me about the pictures. Apparently it wasn't so funny. The apology was mine because I truly didn't realize what had happened until it was to late. Doesn't really matter at this point anyways. Just wanted to set the record straight.: End Quote. LOP

Quote NZorak:
"Yes, I did post using her account, with her permission, and I don't feel one tiny bit bad about any part of what I said. Dangergirl is a fucking judgmental bitch who needs to learn when to shut the fuck up. If this offended anybody's tender sensibilities, I couldn't really give a shit." End Quote.

Quote LOP:
"It's ok. Everyone believes I was behind this. True be told, that day I was really not feeling well. I had an awful migraine and was in bed most of the day." End Quote.

*rolls eyes* Gee, LOP wandered away from her computer, and let NZorak post on her account...*How convenient*

NZorak being his usual charming, *classy* self...

And then, LOP alluding to her "not feeling well" blah, blah, blah. Again, *how convenient*

All of which is absolutely IRRELEVANT to the main point:

Why is it, from across several different boards, LOP/Bratt, and NZorak/Bullit somehow manage to make a huge number of people--many of whom are unrelated, and are not on the same boards--inspiring these so many people to hate them, and hold them both in utter disgust and contempt?

It's a simple question, really. I doubt they have thought about the answers as to why.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

[Lisa Nadazdy]

Now she's banned from CM too.

Whoa. Didn't see that coming.:jaded:

[Merganser]

EhtoZee (haha, suck it canadian!) must be dying of orgasmosis or something by now.

[Scutisorex Shrewlord]

Whoa. Didn't see that coming.:jaded:

I know, it's so unpredictable it swings around to predictability!

[Thoth-Amon]

Girl is burning her bridges faster than a fat beard through Cheeto's.

[Keeper of Secrets]

Did you see she left me all her cash before she was banned?

[Thoth-Amon]

Did you see she left me all her cash before she was banned?

I wouldn't touch that money with a 10' pole it's dirty mang as dirty as a 2 bit whore(LoP).

[Dr. Paragon]

All I can say is.... wow.:eye-popping:
Agreed, I though my eyes were going to roll out of my head after reading all
that. Oh well time to wheel out the "Juggernaut of Disgust":
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v241/Devora/giantrolleyesofDOOM.gif

[Janos]

Good riddens. I was never really fond of them, but didn't have the massive hatred some people did. None the less, the drama quota around those two alone was enough to bring scorn, and eventually loathing. Now's the relief stage.

That banning removes them from places I post at. I'd like to forget they exist, and go awhile without more drama surrounding those two.

[SHARK]

Greetings!

Well, seeing that NZ was perma-banned from CM--and LOP KNEW that Morrus told her that allowing him to use her account was forbidden--she then admits that she let NZ use her account to go on CM...

Do we gargle with cement and snort jello here, or what?

HELLO?

How fucking stupid can you be, you know? And now she's perma-banned from CM, all due--whether directly or indirectly--from her own stupidity and irresponsibility.

Of course, it makes me wonder also, what kind of RESPECT does NZ have for his *wife* by posting on her account, in any way, shape, or form? Gee, that's very respectful and considerate, now ain't it?

Unless, of course, LOP completely agrees with anything and everything NZ might say...

*shrugs*

In any event, I don't know...the apology was just weak. It all stinks of some whiny, bitchy fucking irresponsible passing the buck excuse making to me. I would question, why does this kind of fucking blowout happen so often? and yet, everytime, of course, there's always some convenient excuse...

Well, where I come from in the real world, there are many things you can open your mouth out to the wrong person, and say the wrong fucking thing, and guess what?

You're fired.

You get your ass beat.

You get perma-banned.

You get a black mark in your personel record.

You get sued.

Etc, etc. and apologies just don't cut it. You cross a line, and you get jack-hammered.

That's the real fucking world.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

[Thoth-Amon]

go awhile without more drama surrounding those two.

God I hope so.

[Lisa Nadazdy]

God I hope so.

I give it a week, tops. :yawn:

[Northcott]

Etc, etc. and apologies just don't cut it. You cross a line, and you get jack-hammered.

That's the real fucking world.


There's a mouth full of truth right there. NZorak's been coasting too long on this sociopathic "it's the internet, so I can be as hateful as I want" binge. He spews hateful, thoughtless tripe and has no qualms about lying or deceiving to either worm his way out of it or to try for another shallow justification.

[Lisa Nadazdy]

There's a mouth full of truth right there. NZorak's been coasting too long on this sociopathic "it's the internet, so I can be as hateful as I want" binge. He spews hateful, thoughtless tripe and has no qualms about lying or deceiving to either worm his way out of it or to try for another shallow justification.

I knew this fellow that liked t think he was a biker (he dated my mother for a spell), and had the biggest damned mouth when he got drunk. He liked to go to the Blues on Whyte, a biker bar on Whyte Ave in Edmonton. I've told him in the past he should keep his gob shut in these places, but nooooooo... he had to shooting his mouth off. He started bad-mouthing one of the local gangs, and lo and behold, they were sitting right behind him, and didn't take too kindly to his words. Next thing you know, he's running for his life after they hit him in the head with a table. I had to drive him to the hospital to stiches put in his head.

Dumbass.

[bunny]

I knew this fellow that liked t think he was a biker (he dated my mother for a spell), and had the biggest damned mouth when he got drunk. He liked to go to the Blues on Whyte, a biker bar on Whyte Ave in Edmonton. I've told him in the past he should keep his gob shut in these places, but nooooooo... he had to shooting his mouth off. He started bad-mouthing one of the local gangs, and lo and behold, they were sitting right behind him, and didn't take too kindly to his words. Next thing you know, he's running for his life after they hit him in the head with a table. I had to drive him to the hospital to stiches put in his head.

Dumbass.


Good story. I miss whyte ave. Actually, I really miss the Princess Theatre.

[Northcott]

I knew this fellow that liked t think he was a biker (he dated my mother for a spell), and had the biggest damned mouth when he got drunk. He liked to go to the Blues on Whyte, a biker bar on Whyte Ave in Edmonton. I've told him in the past he should keep his gob shut in these places, but nooooooo... he had to shooting his mouth off. He started bad-mouthing one of the local gangs, and lo and behold, they were sitting right behind him, and didn't take too kindly to his words. Next thing you know, he's running for his life after they hit him in the head with a table. I had to drive him to the hospital to stiches put in his head.

Dumbass.

I suppose it's bad of me that your story made me laugh. :) The last bar I worked at... back in '97 or '98... the lads from Satan's Choice used to come in to hang out. Raised area in the back of the bar, they'd come in on Friday nights, have a few beers and go for a mellow evening. The bar owner was an old friend of theirs, some said an associate, and they never, ever started shit up. They paid their tabs and bothered nobody.

But Kitchener-Waterloo has two Universities and one college, with several cities near here having their own Universities. Every now and again we'd get in drunken schoolboys who thought they were something special 'cause daddy bought 'em a car for a graduation gift, and they were on the university football team. Then they'd lip off one of the lads in the choice. Damned if that didn't result in some of the most dramatic beatings I've ever seen or heard about. One or two were funny as Hell, and a couple more were just fucking scary.

[Phantom Stranger]

NZ did it, using her account.

http://www.circvsmaximvs.com/showthread.php?t=29885
Hmm I was going to post that same thing damn you Steampunk.

And I'm an Asshole for calling them two faced. Nice to see Self-Fulfilling policy in action.

[Lisa Nadazdy]

The point is, that yes, you may have the right to say what you like (free speech and all that), but there are some places where it's just not a good idea to do so. Sure, you may be in the right to say so, and they may be in the wrong to lay the beat-down, but I don't have much sympathy for you when you're dragged to the hospital. It just ain't smart to piss some people off.

[Thoth-Amon]

stuff

With this story and other's you've told I really think you should start a thread of them. Northcott's story hour . :)

[Phantom Stranger]

The point is, that yes, you may have the right to say what you like (free speech and all that), but there are some places where it's just not a good idea to do so. Sure, you may be in the right to say so, and they may be in the wrong to lay the beat-down, but I don't have much sympathy for you when you're dragged to the hospital. It just ain't smart to piss some people off.
There's a right, and then there's the responsibility inherit in that right.

[Northcott]

The point is, that yes, you may have the right to say what you like (free speech and all that), but there are some places where it's just not a good idea to do so. Sure, you may be in the right to say so, and they may be in the wrong to lay the beat-down, but I don't have much sympathy for you when you're dragged to the hospital. It just ain't smart to piss some people off.

When Shark, Stranger, yourself, and I all agree as often as we have been lately, it's generally a sign that the Big Computer (http://www.kaytastrophe.com/vb/showthread.php?t=313&page=3) is about to blue screen and fuck up our SimLife.

[Lisa Nadazdy]

When Shark, Stranger, yourself, and I all agree as often as we have been lately, it's generally a sign that the Big Computer (http://www.kaytastrophe.com/vb/showthread.php?t=313&page=3) is about to blue screen and fuck up our SimLife.

The question is: who will be there for the Great Reboot in the sky?

[Blue Eyed Frau]

I wouldn't touch that money with a 10' pole it's dirty mang as dirty as a 2 bit whore(LoP).

Yep I would have to agree with that there KoS ! Glad to see that man evil bitch banned now, finally free from the Draders I hope, :jump:

[Maynard G. Krebs]

NZ did it, using her account.

http://www.circvsmaximvs.com/showthread.php?t=29885

Bullshit, look at this:

http://www.circvsmaximvs.com/showthread.php?p=442986#post442986

[Bagpuss]

For those that don't know what is HO?

[SHARK]

Greetings!

I just posted this.

Quote SHARK:
Greetings!

Hello there. LOP, and NZorak. I have always been a direct, straight-forward kind of person. So, here's a question for you both.

Have you ever asked yourselves why that on two different message-boards, that the both of you generate such hate and contempt from so many different people?

NB: And yes, I realise that there is some degree of cross-pollenation of members from Nothingland to Circus Maximus--but at the same time, many of the people that despise you both are separate from the others, and are not members of the other respective board.

Indeed, neither of you are me--and I'm not you; however, thinking of myself, and many other people that have had long-standing memberships--for years now--at EN-World, Circus Maximus, Nothingland, SO, etc, etc, and somehow--manage to be a member of such communities and not generate such constant drama, hatred, and problems, all needing volumes of explanations and apologies. It just makes me wonder, what is the fucking problem? As I think about it, jesus, a lot of this kind of constant drama and hand-wringing, hatred, shit-fests have been going on and reoccuring for...months, even years now? And it always seems like either LOP or NZorak--or both of you--are somehow, always at the center of the hurricane of shit. I just think that is rather amazing. The internet and these various messageboards have never had a shortage of people that enjoy debates, confrontation, and such--and yet, as asinine as many jackasses can be--they are not at the center of the hurricane of shit. It always seems to be LOP or NZorak. I think that is mind-boggling.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
End Quote.

I wonder how they will respond? Perhaps I will be banned with the banhammer? *shrugs*

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

[Maynard G. Krebs]

For those that don't know what is HO?

Happy Ordnance (http://www.happyordnance.com), one of two messageboards the Draders own.

[BOZ]

Now she's banned from CM too.

yeah... i do believe they were warned about that. they didn't listen, thus that's the end of it.

[BOZ]

*rolls eyes* Gee, LOP wandered away from her computer, and let NZorak post on her account...*How convenient*

yeah, that excuse is surprisingly similar to "no, officer, those aren't my drugs. someone must have left them in my car." :rolleyes:

[Keeper of Secrets]

Ah but what about this theory:

LoP realizes she's in too deep with the insults OR NZ said them. Regardless, would it not be better to come clean (or scapegoat NZ) and be banned rather than be seen as the more heartless bytch on the interweb?

[Dr. Paragon]

Ah but what about this theory:

LoP realizes she's in too deep with the insults OR NZ said them. Regardless, would it not be better to come clean (or scapegoat NZ) and be banned rather than be seen as the more heartless bytch on the interweb?

Ah, but more importantly; Why should we give a fuck?
:cool:

[The Winslow]

NZ did it, using her account.

http://www.circvsmaximvs.com/showthread.php?t=29885

Yeah, and I subscribed to the semi-private forum and read all that tripe to find He-Bratt's post; and didn't find it anywhere. Everything was distinctly sLoPpy. Then people quoted the thing from HO proving that it wasn't him, but her and only her.

I knew they were both very childish, but even then that's quite a disappointment.

[cnath.rm]

Happy Ordnance (http://www.happyordnance.com), one of two messageboards the Draders own.Three actually, as far as I know AftermathRPG is still up and running.

[Bagpuss]

Well she's permabanned too now so that will stop an confusion over if it's her or Darrin posting from her account.

[EhtoZed]

Why are there still people supporting them? Trainz is over there patting them on the back. WTF?

[Thoth-Amon]

Well she's permabanned too now so that will stop an confusion over if it's her or Darrin posting from her account.
Hid brother Azathoth still has an account at CM. I can bet you anything they will be using that account.

[Steampunk]

Why are there still people supporting them? Trainz is over there patting them on the back. WTF?

I saw that, and it is pretty disgusting.

[Trainz]

You guys are getting a kick out of all this, aren't you?

Damn, with all the drama Zorak generates, you should give him a salary. If it wasn't for him, who would there be to hate?

I've said it before and again... some people take the internet way too fucking seriously.

[Droid101]

Why are there still people supporting them? Trainz is over there patting them on the back. WTF?

Trainz is one of their zombies because they let him be a mod when they were in charge of NTL.


Happy Ordnance (http://www.happyordnance.com), one of two messageboards the Draders own.


You guys are pathetic. Just ban me.
I was on the fence about registering at HappyO, but this sealed it. I'm tired of their shit as well.

Too bad really, Name Lips and a couple of other people only post over there and I guess I won't be seeing them much anymore. Oh well.

[Droid101]

You guys are getting a kick out of all this, aren't you?

Damn, with all the drama Zorak generates, you should give him a salary. If it wasn't for him, who would there be to hate?

I've said it before and again... some people take the internet way too fucking seriously.

That's classy Trainz. One of your masters insults someone on a very touchy subject and you run to their defense.

You've really fallen far in the time I've known you here. :mad:

[Bagpuss]

Give Trainz a break he said the rape comment was out of line. He was just saying he appreciates the drama these to create.

[The Winslow]

Hid brother Azathoth still has an account at CM. I can bet you anything they will be using that account.

Uh. I dare hope Azathoth doesn't live in the same house as Nzorak and Bratt... So I don't see this happening much.

[Droid101]

Give Trainz a break he said the rape comment was out of line. He was just saying he appreciates the drama these to create.

I appreciate drama as much as the next guy, but NZ and LoP's 'vapid attention whoring' to 'fun drama' ratio isn't very favorable.

[EhtoZed]

You guys are getting a kick out of all this, aren't you?

Damn, with all the drama Zorak generates, you should give him a salary. If it wasn't for him, who would there be to hate?

I've said it before and again... some people take the internet way too fucking seriously.
WTF? And I mean WTF!?

You accuse me of being to mean and hurting their feelings and then they turn around and tell DG to get over being raped and you say it's just a joke, don't take shit so seriously? That is fucking disgusting. If this is how you really feel you fucking belong with them.

I don't even know what to fucking say anymore. Fuck

[Enk]

You know what I wish? I wish that we'd stop spending so much time digging up shit on people who don't post here. Even people who (very heartily) deserve derision for their actions.

Except for politicians, public figures, Darwin Awards nominees, and Tom Cruise. Because double standards are delicious.

[Bagpuss]

then they turn around and tell DG to get over being raped and you say it's just a joke, don't take shit so seriously?

Care to provide a link? As far as I can see all Trainz has said is folks shouldn't take what's said on the internet so seriously, not the rape itself. I must of missed where he actually told DG to get over a rape.

[Trainz]

WTF? And I mean WTF!?

You accuse me of being to mean and hurting their feelings and then they turn around and tell DG to get over being raped and you say it's just a joke, don't take shit so seriously? That is fucking disgusting. If this is how you really feel you fucking belong with them.

I don't even know what to fucking say anymore. Fuck

Chill dude.

If you post something on the internet and it gets used to bite you back in the ass later, its your fault. I've posted pics of my daughter in the past, and people have used their knowledge of her to snipe at me for YEARS man, YEARS. Some have said I fuck her, hell look at the thread KoS made right on this here board. What was my response?

Precisely.

So, again, to all the fucking loosers who get their only kicks out of messageboard drama, stop taking the internet so fucking seriously.

But, hey, A2Z, hate away bud, hate away. Just drop the holier than thou attitude bud, you of all people...

[Droid101]

So, again, to all the fucking loosers who get their only kicks out of messageboard drama, stop taking the internet so fucking seriously.


There's a difference between ribbing each other about pictures we may have posted (oh, u fucked ur daughter, lolz; oh, u wear eyeliner, lolz) and bringing up something legitimately painful and difficult to deal with.

[Bagpuss]

Yeah accusing someone of incest and paedophilia is just funny. :rolleyes:

If anyone (DG) puts stuff about a traumatic experience out on the internet, then they have to be prepared for someone (LoP or NZorak I really don't care who) to be a dick about it.

Actually DG handled the insult really well, if anything I thought Trainz comments weren't aimed at DG, but at all the folks that are "White-Knighting" for her. From DG's post it seems to me she's perfectly capable of nothing taking the internet so seriously and certainly doesn't take LoP seriously.

[Trainz]

There's a difference between ribbing each other about pictures we may have posted (oh, u fucked ur daughter, lolz; oh, u wear eyeliner, lolz) and bringing up something legitimately painful and difficult to deal with.

You're right. I'm sorry.

I should never have made fun of your eyeliner pic.

I hope you recover from all the ribbing you got from it.

[Droid101]

Yeah accusing someone of incest and paedophilia is just funny. :rolleyes:

I fucked your mom last night, and she said I was better in bed than you. Then I gave her the nickel I owed her.




Incest joke, and yet, I don't see anyone getting offended. :rolleyes::rolleyes:

[Trainz]

I fucked your mom last night, and she said I was better in bed than you. Then I gave her the nickel I owed her.

Incest joke, and yet, I don't see anyone getting offended. :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Holy shit you're clueless. Saying a mom joke without background info is impersonal.

The stuff I posted about my daughter was very personal at the time. She was having a bit of a rough time as a teen (now she's a great girl, TY for asking), and people were using the accumulated data on her to rip me a new one. After a week of frustration, I decided to not take anything from the messageboards about her seriously.

[Droid101]

Holy shit you're clueless. Saying a mom joke without background info is impersonal.

The stuff I posted about my daughter was very personal at the time. She was having a bit of a rough time as a teen (now she's a great girl, TY for asking), and people were using the accumulated data on her to rip me a new one. After a week of frustration, I decided to not take anything from the messageboards about her seriously.

I'd say you're the one who is clueless.

People were clearly joking about your daughter. In fact, you should probably take it as a compliment, because if nobody found your daughter attractive, the jokes would never have been made.

There's a world of difference between making something up that clearly isn't real and using it as a gag, and dredging up a massively painful personal issue from someone's past and using it to try to hurt the person.

But that's okay, I realize you have to continue to slobber on Darrin's dick or else you won't get to be a mod anymore. :rolleyes:

[Bagpuss]

I'm still curious as to where Trainz did either of the following...

1) Told DG to get over the rape.
2) Told DG to stop taking the internet so seriously.

[Droid101]

I'm still curious as to where Trainz did either of the following...

1) Told DG to get over the rape.
2) Told DG to stop taking the internet so seriously.

Who said he did that?

People just said that on HO he was defending Darrin.

Whatever, I don't even care anymore. Those two are like a non-entity to me now. Took me a while to realize what A2Z and GL were frothing about, but I think I finally have a decent perspective now after it's been smashed into my face so many times in the past four months.

[Bagpuss]

I fucked your mom last night, and she said I was better in bed than you. Then I gave her the nickel I owed her.

So that's explains why she couldn't babysit my daughter/sister last night.

[Bagpuss]

Who said he did that?


You accuse me of being to mean and hurting their feelings and then they turn around and tell DG to get over being raped and you say it's just a joke, don't take shit so seriously?

I missed the "they" on first reading the above, my mistake.

[Trainz]

I'd say you're the one who is clueless.

And I still say that if you provide personal sensitive info on a public board, don't act so surprised if it gets used in the future against you if you decide to act in a confrontational manner at some point.

Zorak was over the line. I probably wouldn't have said that myself. Does that make him the villain he's made out to be? Hell no. It's the nature of the beast we call the internet.

Shit, this type of stuff goes back to the days of usenet.

[Bagpuss]

Are we even sure Zorak said it or if he wasn't just falling on his sword to cover for LoP saying it?

[Trainz]

Are we even sure Zorak said it or if he wasn't just falling on his sword to cover for LoP saying it?

No no no, he's guilty as charged. It's the nature of the crime we're debating on.

[Bagpuss]

I think the crime is being a prick, and the accused is guilty as charged and I think DG hit the nail on the head with LoP self-esteem issues, if you need proof just look at who she's hooked up with.



Shit I think I could be white-knighting, still it was too good to waste.

[Droid101]

Are we even sure Zorak said it or if he wasn't just falling on his sword to cover for LoP saying it?I'm still betting LoP said it, but it doesn't matter really. They're like one two-headed beast to me now, anyway.

No no no, he's guilty as charged. It's the nature of the crime we're debating on.

Like we can trust you when it comes to them.
I think the crime is being a prick, and the accused is guilty as charged and I think DG hit the nail on the head with LoP self-esteem issues, if you need proof just look at who she's hooked up with.

Agreed in full.

[TiQuinn]

Zorak was over the line. I probably wouldn't have said that myself. Does that make him the villain he's made out to be? Hell no. It's the nature of the beast we call the internet.


IMO, it's not any one thing.

It's a combination of many instances where he and his wife, as a team, acted in a way that make them villains.

[EhtoZed]

So, again, to all the fucking loosers who get their only kicks out of messageboard drama, stop taking the internet so fucking seriously.

But, hey, A2Z, hate away bud, hate away. Just drop the holier than thou attitude bud, you of all people...
They've played the martyr card so often I've lost count. They lie about who said what, they appologise and then laugh about it at their homebase. They're fucking hypocrits and everyone can see it but you.

You talk about 'loosers who get their only kicks out of messageboard drama' but that's exactly what you're congratulating them on.

[Trainz]

You talk about 'loosers who get their only kicks out of messageboard drama' but that's exactly what you're congratulating them on.

Oh, I did?

Quote?

[Janos]

Oh, I did?

Quote?

You're feeding it at least. Every time someone supports them or acknowledges it, they get just enough reinforcement to continue. That said, the massive outpouring of negative attention has the exact same effect, and why most of us just need to ignore it and move on.

Zorak is the puppy that shits in the corner then looks at you wagging his tail.

[Northcott]

So, again, to all the fucking loosers who get their only kicks out of messageboard drama, stop taking the internet so fucking seriously.

The other option is to, y'know, actually act like a functional human being instead of a sociopath with dick-sizing issues. Unfortunately, some folks seem incapable of that.

Don't try and cop this attitude that the bullshit just rolls off your back. I distinctly remember you having a meltdown or two, good solid bursts of (fully justified) rage over the purile behaviour of some members... and not just at the time of the initial flaying you received after posting her pics.

You're engaging in a double-standard, Trainz. EhtoZed has certainly crossed the line in how he dealt with them in the past, but their behaviour doesn't appear much better.


Speaking of which -- Cheezy. Dude, I owe you an apology of sorts. I still think some of your cracks were out of line and that you were too obsessed with LoP... but man, you were right all along. Neither of them can be trusted worth a damn.


There's a world of difference between making something up that clearly isn't real and using it as a gag, and dredging up a massively painful personal issue from someone's past and using it to try to hurt the person.

Nah. Kids are a super-sensitive topic, man. The kind of shots that Trainz took over that subject were utterly reprehensible. I didn't even see the initial blow-up, but the tidbits I've seen since have sickened me. There are certain lines that shouldn't be crossed.

Old-fashioned of me, I suppose, but I don't see it as being in the least appropriate to take swipes at people's kids, wives, etc, if you're scrapping with somebody. Unless that shot happens to be grounded in the truth, that is.

[Droid101]

Old-fashioned of me, I suppose, but I don't see it as being in the least appropriate to take swipes at people's kids, wives, etc, if you're scrapping with somebody. Unless that shot happens to be grounded in the truth, that is.

So are you saying GreyOne's "Whose moms I've slept with" thread was in bad taste? Or all the times anyone jokes about sleeping with other people's wives when they're out of town?

[EhtoZed]

Speaking of which -- Cheezy. Dude, I owe you an apology of sorts. I still think some of your cracks were out of line and that you were too obsessed with LoP... but man, you were right all along. Neither of them can be trusted worth a damn. You don't owe me an apology man, no one does. I've gone way past the line more than once. But, I don't think I've ever denied it. And I deserve to be called on it when I do it.

But, what get's me is people like Trainz and Algolei making me out to be the worst thing since Hitler while bending over backwards to make apologies for the draders.

Oh, I did?

Quote?Because I'm a fucking sap I'll venture back to HO. I wish they'd make unregistered users unable to see the posts already. I just can't turn away.

:roofle:

Man, the internet is entertaining nowadays. Too bad I miss most of it.

As I said, 1's and 0's... I think I'll be able to fall asleep tonight.

Hey, you guys are great for the internet. Look at the ammount of drama you generate with but a few posts. They should be paying you a fee for the unending entertainment they get out of hating you both.

Am I the only one seing a parallell between all this and 1984? Am I?

Even Borko uses this drama to make himself look good in comparison.

Everybody wins!

Posting the rape thing was out of line. I'm not saying you shouldn't have, I'm not saying I actually give two shits, but a spade is a spade.

[cnath.rm]

You don't owe me an apology man, no one does. I've gone way past the line more than once. But, I don't think I've ever denied it. And I deserve to be called on it when I do it.

But, what get's me is people like Trainz and Algolei making me out to be the worst thing since Hitler while bending over backwards to make apologies for the draders. My only issue with you what that you (for awhile at least, which has thankfully changed) seemed to be a one trick pony with one topic.

I agree with Northcott that there are some things that shouldn't be brought into the normal joking and crap that gets flung around. I also think that there is a line... and when whoever said it finished saying it, I'm not sure they could see the line from where they were. The old "too far" smiley comes to mind.

[Northcott]

So are you saying GreyOne's "Whose moms I've slept with" thread was in bad taste? Or all the times anyone jokes about sleeping with other people's wives when they're out of town?

It's a matter of scale. If somebody's mother just died, or they've posted a thread on how their mother is currently wrestling with some horrid wasting disease, and they post old pictures of their mother in better times, from better memories... then yes, the gut-crawling fuckhead who starts with the mom-fucking jokes deserves a shot in the head.

People who use the distance of the internet to act like sociopaths sicken me. There's a line between joking around with somebody and using personal information to hit them on a personal level. I'm not sure whether our community is better or worse than the average for this particular trend.


Because I'm a fucking sap I'll venture back to HO. I wish they'd make unregistered users unable to see the posts already. I just can't turn away.

You know, when we do finally get together for a little KT Frat Party, I'm going to slap you upside the head. WTF?!? Man, the source of your dislike is removed from the communities you haunt, and so you're going to them?

Think about that. Think about it carefully.

[Enk]

So are you saying GreyOne's "Whose moms I've slept with" thread was in bad taste? Or all the times anyone jokes about sleeping with other people's wives when they're out of town?

To the best of my knowledge, mother and wives are fair game when playing the dozens. Kids, not so much.

[Space Cadet B^3]

Still absorbing all this... going to have to make some tough decisions about where I spend my time online after this. There's people posting all over I don't want to lose touch with, but...

I'm not entirely comfortable anywhere anymore.

[Trainz]

But, what get's me is people like Trainz and Algolei making me out to be the worst thing since Hitler while bending over backwards to make apologies for the draders.

You always overstate everything and are thus summarilly dissmissed.7

Because I'm a fucking sap I'll venture back to HO. I wish they'd make unregistered users unable to see the posts already. I just can't turn away.

Thanks. Now post THE REST and people can really make their own conclusions.

Hypocrite.

[EhtoZed]

You know, when we do finally get together for a little KT Frat Party, I'm going to slap you upside the head. WTF?!? Man, the source of your dislike is removed from the communities you haunt, and so you're going to them?

Think about that. Think about it carefully.I know. In my defense I didn't go looking for it. Someone posted a link at CM and I saw Trainz's comments. He denied them and asked me to quote them. I won't be lurking there look for drama though. I just couldn't resist the quote them demand.

I'm not entirely comfortable anywhere anymore.Why aren't you comfortable here? Almost everyone seems to be here. And I'm pretty sure this drama will have quieted by tonight.

You always overstate everything and are thus summarilly dissmissed.7That makes no sense.

Thanks. Now post THE REST and people can really make their own conclusions.

Hypocrite.That is everything you said asswipe. If there's something else you post it because I'm taking Northcott's advice and staying away from there now.

[doc]

Warped, sad but warped

[Dark Jezter]

Wow, first Wanger Rickett's drama, then BrutusMaximus turns out to be ArtQ, and now Bratt's getting banned.

This last week or so has had a ton of entertaining drama at CM. :)

[fett527]

Wow, first Wanger Rickett's drama, then BrutusMaximus turns out to be ArtQ, and now Bratt's getting banned.

This last week or so has had a ton of entertaining drama at CM. :)

You don't have to fucking rub it in. :gnash:

[doc]

Seems to me that it was "The Girls" that started the dog pile on Lop/ Bratt, lord knows she's a DQ but as long as she doesn't flash her boobs on CM who's buisness is it.

[Phantom Stranger]

Seems to me that it was "The Girls" that started the dog pile on Lop/ Bratt, lord knows she's a DQ but as long as she doesn't flash her boobs on CM who's buisness is it.
Go back and read it man, she posted shit she wasn't supposed to post which started the whole entitlement war yadda yadda.

But yeah, now that they are in their own neighborhood now without a chance of running into them anytime soon, I'm a happy camper and this should make it better for everyone here.

[doc]

I skimmed the dreg so I must have missed it.

[Steampunk]

Wow, first Wanger Rickett's drama, then BrutusMaximus turns out to be ArtQ, and now Bratt's getting banned.

This last week or so has had a ton of entertaining drama at CM. :)

And now, a lot of people are meeting up at GenCon. Undoubtedly some drama HAS to come from that!

[Northcott]

And now, a lot of people are meeting up at GenCon. Undoubtedly some drama HAS to come from that!

It makes me wish I was going. :(

[Droid101]

It's okay Trainz, we get it. Since it's the internets, and shouldn't be taken seriously, everything NZ and LoP do doesn't matter, and so you should champion them at every turn.

[Martin]

I've said it before and again... some people take the internet way too fucking seriously.

Just so that I'm clear on something, Trainz, but are you saying that people shouldn't be held accountable for their actions on the Internet?

[cnath.rm]

Just so that I'm clear on something, Trainz, but are you saying that people shouldn't be held accountable for their actions on the Internet?Can't speak for him, but for myself I know I tend to hold people accountable a shorter amount of time/to a lesser degree if it's online behavior. Hell, if some of what happened on the last couple of NTL incarnations had happened in what small circle of friends I've had in my life, I can't really say that I'd have been anywhere as near ready to bury the hatchet** as I've been with the actions having taken place online.

**(or at least to avoid burying it in someones head/chest/extremities, whatever I could hit really, not sure how picky I could be as I've never really had any training with killing people, much less using hatchets which seem to be like they would be workable, but not really optimal for the task of actually killing someone. YMMV of course.)

The above text is NOT to be considered flirting and also Not A Death Threat.

[Steampunk]

Can't speak for him, but for myself I know I tend to hold people accountable a shorter amount of time/to a lesser degree if it's online behavior. Hell, if some of what happened on the last couple of NTL incarnations had happened in what small circle of friends I've had in my life, I can't really say that I'd have been anywhere as near ready to bury the hatchet** as I've been with the actions having taken place online.

**(or at least to avoid burying it in someones head/chest/extremities, whatever I could hit really, not sure how picky I could be as I've never really had any training with killing people, much less using hatchets which seem to be like they would be workable, but not really optimal for the task of actually killing someone. YMMV of course.)

The above text is NOT to be considered flirting and also Not A Death Threat.

Stop flirting with me.

[Scutisorex Shrewlord]

Just so that I'm clear on something, Trainz, but are you saying that people shouldn't be held accountable for their actions on the Internet?

Yeah cause I remember a whole lotta scorn thrown in my direction by a bunch of folks, Trainz included. I think what Trainz really means is people should be held accountable when he disagrees with them.

[Trainz]

Yeah cause I remember a whole lotta scorn thrown in my direction by a bunch of folks, Trainz included. I think what Trainz really means is people should be held accountable when he disagrees with them.


I don't remember that but I'll trust you.

I might be talking out of my arse. I don't really know or care. FWIW, I've disagreed with their actions at times and told them so. I call a spade a spade.

Make of that what you will, it's not that important.

[BOZ]

And now, a lot of people are meeting up at GenCon. Undoubtedly some drama HAS to come from that!

you know what, maybe i just miss out on it, but whenever i've hung out with ENW or NTL people at GC, everyone's fairly pleasant with one another in person. can't say that i've witnessed any drama flareups.

now, when we get back on the boards... that's another story. ;)

[Scutisorex Shrewlord]

Make of that what you will, it's not that important.

And that is the Gospel truth. :)

[Trainz]

And that is the Gospel truth. :)

Amen.

[Northcott]

you know what, maybe i just miss out on it, but whenever i've hung out with ENW or NTL people at GC, everyone's fairly pleasant with one another in person. can't say that i've witnessed any drama flareups.

now, when we get back on the boards... that's another story. ;)

I maintain that you see the true face of people when consequences are removed or minimized. If someone acts like a dick on a messageboard, but is mild and polite IRL, chances are that they're just presenting a false face.

[SHARK]

I maintain that you see the true face of people when consequences are removed or minimized. If someone acts like a dick on a messageboard, but is mild and polite IRL, chances are that they're just presenting a false face.

Greetings!

Yeah, damn fucking right, Northcott! Fucking two-faced, whining back-stabbing pussies can just choke on a bottle of their own fucking jism as far as I am concerned.

Fucking cowardly, goddamned fucking spineless pussies.

Them kinda people I have no use for whatesover...and you know what?

If I'm really feeling one of my moods--I'd even serve it to them right in fucking public, too, and dress them down like they wouldn't fucking believe. I've done it before...as my friends alertly keep on eye on holding me back at times...because they know I honestly have ZERO FUCKING TOLERANCE for swarmy, two-faced little pussies. Fucking ZERO.

*SHARK takes a long puff on his fine Arturo Fuente Opus X cigar, and sips some good coffee...*

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

[Scutisorex Shrewlord]

I maintain that you see the true face of people when consequences are removed or minimized. If someone acts like a dick on a messageboard, but is mild and polite IRL, chances are that they're just presenting a false face.

Well kinda I guess. I think a big problem too is miscommunication over the internet. It's hard to detect subtlety and sarcasm through the typed words on the screen.

[PWD]

Some people are definitely whiny shitweasels because they can get away with it, but to say that's everyone? Some people really are playing.

I think it's real easy to take too broad a stance on this, particularly amongst a group of gamers.

Now, hit people with what they've done, certainly. If they don't make up for it in other ways, or they never ever break character, then so be it. If they're playing around and redeem themselves, then that's different.

[Northcott]

Well kinda I guess. I think a big problem too is miscommunication over the internet. It's hard to detect subtlety and sarcasm through the typed words on the screen.

Entirely true, man. Entirely true. Miscommunication happens often enough, but it's worse in this medium. Clarity of communication is key.

But mistakes aside, I'm sure any of us can, at the drop of a hat, think of at least a few individuals who went way beyond the possibility of miscommunications and fronted blatantly vicious or perpetually bombastic personas.

[PWD]

Entirely true, man. Entirely true. Miscommunication happens often enough, but it's worse in this medium. Clarity of communication is key.

But mistakes aside, I'm sure any of us can, at the drop of a hat, think of at least a few individuals who went way beyond the possibility of miscommunications and fronted blatantly vicious or perpetually bombastic personas.

Oh hell yes. And sometimes that too was a matter of perspective. Lord knows a lot of people have good reason to genuinely hate Izrador, and yet most of us have grudgingly come to enjoy having him around. Fuck, I traded chips with the bastard!

Then there are just as many who wrote him off permanently, or me, or others, based on some silly game we were playing that struck a nerve.

[Northcott]

Some people are definitely whiny shitweasels because they can get away with it, but to say that's everyone? Some people really are playing.

I think it's real easy to take too broad a stance on this, particularly amongst a group of gamers.

Now, hit people with what they've done, certainly. If they don't make up for it in other ways, or they never ever break character, then so be it. If they're playing around and redeem themselves, then that's different.

But therein lays the rub, man. That person can play in that manner because their are no consequences. They can get some people wound up or hurt others, and sit back and laugh about the grand 'game' they're playing... and then dismiss it all as unimportant because they don't have to deal with face-to-face consequences. Stripping somebody down verbally on the internet is one thing. Seeing them reduced to tears in real life is another.

This separation makes it easy to maintain the illusion of this being a game. The truth is, though, that on the other end of the screen is (almost always) another human being. Maybe a fucked-up one with some really craptastic ideas, but a human being nonetheless. The only difference between fucking with somebody's head via the internet and doing so in person, the mail, or over the phone is a) the medium and b) the freedom of perceived consequence granted by distance.

This can also make it difficult to know when to slam on the breaks and halt a joke, or to know when somebody's being honest in their backlash... but that's part of the trick. The safety of separation. All interaction provides us with a mirror of ourselves, if we choose to see it. Interaction without consequences is the most brutally honest mirror of all.

[PWD]

Eh, I've played my roles, and I've done it with enough of a wink and a grin that anyone should have been able to play along. I'm comfortable with that, and perfectly ready and willing to take a punch if I ever have to should I meet people.

For Izrador, his style was to be so blatantly over the top and unreasonable that you had to hold yourself back even when you knew he was trolling.

Now, then you have the true, genuine shit stirrers, those who weren't satisfied without seeing blood. Those are different animals entirely.

I'm not suggesting there aren't that type, only that it's way too convenient and sweeping to suggest that anyone who acts in some way outrageously is doing so solely because they think they can get away with it and are genuine real life shitweasels. What you see as outrageous beyond the pale behavior the next person could see as funny, and the person after that could see it as just another day on the internet.

That's kinda my point. Half the goddamn board at CM thinks I'm worse than hitler because I dogpiled Queenie, and fought back like a cornered wombat when the white knights came to town. Other folks know different.

It can't excuse everything, and lord knows even I have gone too far, but it just doesn't wash as a theory.

[Scutisorex Shrewlord]

But therein lays the rub, man. That person can play in that manner because their are no consequences. They can get some people wound up or hurt others, and sit back and laugh about the grand 'game' they're playing... and then dismiss it all as unimportant because they don't have to deal with face-to-face consequences. Stripping somebody down verbally on the internet is one thing. Seeing them reduced to tears in real life is another.

And I have to say that the worst I have ever felt on the internet, the most disappointed I was in my own actions, had to do with the fact that some people felt my rant about Mr. Christopher was intended to hurt him in real life. I didn't even think about that when writing it. I was trying to be absurd and a little mean, but I definitely didn't mean to hurt anybody for real. That has really changed my outlook on how I conduct myself on the 'net. Not saying I won't be an asshole from time to time, just that in the future I'm going to make damned sure people take it the way it was intended.

This separation makes it easy to maintain the illusion of this being a game. The truth is, though, that on the other end of the screen is (almost always) another human being. Maybe a fucked-up one with some really craptastic ideas, but a human being nonetheless. The only difference between fucking with somebody's head via the internet and doing so in person, the mail, or over the phone is a) the medium and b) the freedom of perceived consequence granted by distance.

Yeah but I don't think most folks think that way when they're in the heat of the moment. Everyone says something without thinking about it, and on the internet that is blindingly easier to do.

[Ancalagon]

But, what get's me is people like Trainz and Algolei making me out to be the worst thing since Hitler while bending over backwards to make apologies for the draders.


Well, I'll be the "voice of reason" here - it's becoming pretty apparent that well, those two attract drama like a lightning rod. I'm not convince they generate all of it - they couldn't do anything in a vacuum - but well a strong patern is developing here.

So yes, you were right. That being said, your sniping got pretty annoying at time, and triggered drama of its own (although of a much smaller scale).

no hard feelings man.

edit:

Nah. Kids are a super-sensitive topic, man. The kind of shots that Trainz took over that subject were utterly reprehensible. I didn't even see the initial blow-up, but the tidbits I've seen since have sickened me. There are certain lines that shouldn't be crossed.

indeed!

Ancalagon

[Ancalagon]

Yeah but I don't think most folks think that way when they're in the heat of the moment. Everyone says something without thinking about it, and on the internet that is blindingly easier to do.

It's because on the internet, you can't get fired, kicked in the balls or punched in the face. The lack of accountability affects us all.

[Scutisorex Shrewlord]

It's because on the internet, you can't get fired, kicked in the balls or punched in the face. The lack of accountability affects us all.

Yeah but it's not just the lack of accountability, it's the lack of foresight. Or maybe we're saying the same thing in different ways.

[PWD]

I don't buy into solely the lack of accountability.

How many of us get into arguments IRL and later on shake our heads about what we'd wished we'd said?

On the internet it's a lot the same, only you get the time to really craft the response you would have wished to say.

Now, that response may have provoked a punch in real life, but it wasn't the avoidance of the punch that brought it out. Clear enough?

[Northcott]

Yeah but it's not just the lack of accountability, it's the lack of foresight. Or maybe we're saying the same thing in different ways.

I think so. Y'see, I think that foresight and accountability are tied into one another; we learn the former by experience with the latter, from the time we're children onward. We work, socially, based on patterns, and those patterns can be very complex. This simple a medium strips back the patterns, and so we can sometimes be utter pricks -- sometimes without meaning to. On the flipside, some people use it to be giant suck-up drama whores who play the perpetual victim. Two sides to the coin, and all that jazz.

So, yes, stripping this down to accountability solely is erroneous in its simplicity. I can't, however, think of a more primal, base level to strip it down to; all our behaviours boil down to accountability to one another, whether through empathy, sense of responsibility, or social pressure. When the signs around that are stripped back, we run into trouble.

Which brings me to...

I don't buy into solely the lack of accountability.

How many of us get into arguments IRL and later on shake our heads about what we'd wished we'd said?

On the internet it's a lot the same, only you get the time to really craft the response you would have wished to say.

Now, that response may have provoked a punch in real life, but it wasn't the avoidance of the punch that brought it out. Clear enough?

Perfectly clear. Now let's extrapolate further: after that punch, how likely is the person in question to maintain that kind of behaviour? Or more gently: if you genuinely make somebody burst into tears IRL, how likely are you to examine your own behaviour in the face of direct consequence? Even if it's only done later -- touching upon your first question.

Here the punch can never be delivered, and the tears are often dismissed as attention whoring/drama queen crap. So a sense of permisiveness creeps in. Without the consequences of direct feedback, even if it's something as simple as a change in facial expression and body language, we're left solely to our own internal censors, and at some point or another on these boards, we've all failed with that.

Hell, I reduced one user to tears in my first big scrap on Nutkinland. Didn't find out for months.


Edit: And none of the above is helped much by the notion that very few people seem to be honest with themselves over their own emotional states.

[Northcott]

All of the above leaving me thinking about this more, and realizing that I'm being unclear in one thing: I'm not referring to single instance moments, but rather the accumulation of patterns of behaviour. I'm not suggesting it's a spontaneous judgement thing for most people, deciding that they'll behave one way or another, but rather that people who aren't looking for the trap, or predisposed to avoiding it through greater empathy or level-headedness (neither of which, I fear, I possess), they stand a higher chance of falling into it.

Though, yeah, some just decide to be pricks.

[Brynja]

Well I just want it to be clear I didn't start this thread to be a prick.

It was the correct forum to vent my spleen on such matters.

I am over it now, I still think she is dog doo but *shrugs* that is SSDD for me.

[Northcott]

Well I just want it to be clear I didn't start this thread to be a prick.

It was the correct forum to vent my spleen on such matters.

I am over it now, I still think she is dog doo but *shrugs* that is SSDD for me.

The flipside of my theory is that some people earn their ass-kicking. :D

[Martin]

I don't buy into solely the lack of accountability.

How many of us get into arguments IRL and later on shake our heads about what we'd wished we'd said?

On the internet it's a lot the same, only you get the time to really craft the response you would have wished to say.

Now, that response may have provoked a punch in real life, but it wasn't the avoidance of the punch that brought it out. Clear enough?

The thing is, you're basing it on the idea that the person making the comment is willing to take the punch: to accept responsibility. I've yet to see that in this particular instance. Neither Drader seems to be particularly inclined to take responsibility for his or her actions (or his/her as the case may be). If someone's willing to stand up and say, "You know, I honestly think that I may have fucked up," I've got a lot more respect for them than if they try to either bluster their way out of the jam or try to retcon their way out of the jam.

I can go into examples of what I mean if my point isn't coming across.

[Martin]

As a side note, I believe that Northcott is the Archie Goodwin to my Nero Wolfe.

[SHARK]

Greetings!

Indeed, it seems like time and time again, there is some giant, weeping-vagina ass-fucking that they need to apologise for.

Yet again.

And Again.

After awhile, it's like, you know what? Your apologies just don't wash anymore. You're a fucking ill-mannered, rude fucking jackass.

Like I said earlier, why are the Draders always at the center of the Hurricane of Shit?????

Trainz attempted to explain it off as "Well, there's always an Intarweb target on every messageboard--and it just turns out that the Draders are it."

That doesn't wash to me. There are too many people--in all of these board incarnations, as well as at CM--who are or have been members for YEARS--that don't have that problem.

I just don't buy it. So many people hate and loathe the Draders, and hold them in utter contempt--many of whom are not related, and not cross-board pollenators--for that to be true, that they are just unfortunately *singled* out.

Why the fuck do they always have a GIANT FUCKING TARGET ON THEIR FOREHEADS????

You know what I'm saying? After awhile, well--a reasonable person must conclude that the Draders have some serious, ongoing, and consistent social problems with large groups of diverse people all around them.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

[Enk]

Yeah but it's not just the lack of accountability, it's the lack of foresight. Or maybe we're saying the same thing in different ways.

I think its learned behavior. The inability of the internet to convey negative reinforcement in a stark enough way leads one to believe that consequences don't actually exist in non-face-to-face interaction.

People don't behave well because they are actively afraid of the fallout from it, they behave well in for the same reason Pavlov's dog salivates - they learn it over a long period of time. When people figure out that the internet doesn't allow for the jimmy kicking, punches in the face, etc. they internalize the lesson that the behavior here doesn't have consequences. From there its just a hop, skip, and jump to extended periods of bad behavior.

[PWD]

The thing is, you're basing it on the idea that the person making the comment is willing to take the punch: to accept responsibility. I've yet to see that in this particular instance. Neither Drader seems to be particularly inclined to take responsibility for his or her actions (or his/her as the case may be). If someone's willing to stand up and say, "You know, I honestly think that I may have fucked up," I've got a lot more respect for them than if they try to either bluster their way out of the jam or try to retcon their way out of the jam.

I can go into examples of what I mean if my point isn't coming across.

I'm not suggesting Northy isn't right with respect to the Draders, I'm saying I object to the blanket statement... since it can easily be applied to me, and I know for a fact it's not my motivation.

But yes, certainly it can be true in cases. It's just flawed as are all blanket statements - even this one.

[Martin]

I'm not suggesting Northy isn't right with respect to the Draders, I'm saying I object to the blanket statement... since it can easily be applied to me, and I know for a fact it's not my motivation.

But yes, certainly it can be true in cases. It's just flawed as are all blanket statements - even this one.

Yes, as a blanket statement, it does apply to you, as it applies to me and as it applies to a great number of people on this and many other messageboards. The difference is that you and I acknowledge that it does apply to us, and further, we take responsibility. We understand that if we do something that earns us a pop in the mouth, then by God, we'll take it.

Others don't seem to see it that way. They walk over the feelings of others while whinging over how their feelings were hurt. They lash out at will and act surprised when people lash out at them. They expect no accountability for their own actions, but request accountability from others. They show little respect, yet offer much in return. It's this behavior with which I find fault.

Trainz claims that people take the Internet too seriously. I'm fine with that, so long as he doesn't mean that to mean absolution of accountability and responsibility. Far too often people use that kind of statement as an excuse for bad behavior, and unfortunately it strongly seems to be the case now.

However, if he's being genuine in his feelings, well, not taking things too seriously is a great attitude to have. In that case, however, I'm curious as to how he defines 'too seriously.' Where is the line? I mean, some people take life too seriously. A great deal of Eastern philosophy resolves around that very idea. But it's all well and good to tell someone "I don't take the Internet seriously. Neither should you." That's the same as the Dalai Lama saying, "Look, I've achieved enlightenment, why haven't you?"

[Harry]

...That's the same as the Dalai Lama saying, "Look, I've achieved enlightenment, why haven't you?"

:eek:

[Daemon Sultan]

I've been lurking around and trying to get a feel for the board.

I could be way off but it kinda seems to me like this community likes the drama, and likes to keep things going. Again, this is only my impression and I could be way off.

[Dr. Paragon]

You know, when we do finally get together for a little KT Frat Party, I'm going to slap you upside the head. WTF?!? Man, the source of your dislike is removed from the communities you haunt, and so you're going to them?

Think about that. Think about it carefully.
I'll hold him.

Seriously, like the title says W T F?!
:rolleyes:

I've been lurking around and trying to get a feel for the board.

I could be way off but it kinda seems to me like this community likes the drama, and likes to keep things going. Again, this is only my impression and I could be way off.

I remember a far of ftime when this board was more fuelled by T3h Shenanigans than T3h Dr4/\/\4.
I wish those times were now again.

[Limper]

I remember a far of ftime when this board was more fuelled by T3h Shenanigans than T3h Dr4/\/\4.
I wish those times were now again.

The problem was the shenanigans created a linger base of drama and long after the fun was over the drama continued. Over time the drama became louder than the shens.

Or mathmaticly represented Y*shens=Ygrudges
grudges last longer than shens
so each shen created at least one grudge which compounded
lingering grudges created drama
drama created more grudges
And so forth.

[Bagpuss]

I believe it's been shown that you need six good pieces of news to over come one bad one. It's a similar thing to what Limper mentions above.

[EhtoZed]

I've been lurking around and trying to get a feel for the board.

I could be way off but it kinda seems to me like this community likes the drama, and likes to keep things going. Again, this is only my impression and I could be way off.
Rather I think this community likes the status quo we've attained and when something disrupts that we try to turn things back around by mocking/ostracising the offender (ad infinitum). And then the funny memes that developed during that continue for years which might make it seem like we've enjoyed the drama when really we've enjoyed the jokes that came from it. Or not, I don't know.

[Varaj]

I've been lurking around and trying to get a feel for the board.

I could be way off but it kinda seems to me like this community likes the drama, and likes to keep things going. Again, this is only my impression and I could be way off.

Me thinks you are focusing on a very small percentage of threads. Perhaps you are finding what you are looking for?

[Bagpuss]

I could be way off but it kinda seems to me like this community likes the drama, and likes to keep things going. Again, this is only my impression and I could be way off.

You have placed no value judgement on this statement please continue lurking until you have an opinion.

[Northcott]

Rather I think this community likes the status quo we've attained and when something disrupts that we try to turn things back around by mocking/ostracising the offender (ad infinitum). And then the funny memes that developed during that continue for years which might make it seem like we've enjoyed the drama when really we've enjoyed the jokes that came from it. Or not, I don't know.

That seems about right. Plus there's a couple of self-important navel-gazing bastards that force us to rehash the issues in an attempt to understand the underlying dynamics of what we...

... oh, fuck. That's me. :expressionless:

I'm not suggesting Northy isn't right with respect to the Draders, I'm saying I object to the blanket statement... since it can easily be applied to me, and I know for a fact it's not my motivation.

But yes, certainly it can be true in cases. It's just flawed as are all blanket statements - even this one.

It does apply to you, as uncomfortable as that may seem. Do you really think you haven't trolled people past the point of tolerance in the past? Do you really think you'd have behaved the same way face-to-face?

It certainly applies to me, and as many people have pointed out in the past, I take this shit more seriously than most. I've accidentally stomped people into the ground, thinking I was responding to somebody who was taking it much better than they really were.

I'm not saying that the motivation is to hurt people, or be an ass, or even escape consequences. Rather that the lack of consequences makes it easier to exaggerate our own behaviour unless we keep a purposeful watch on that. And worse, even when we do keep an eye on our own behaviour, maintaining some semblance of 'real life' discourse, we can still trip over that line as the myriad of warning signs we depend on in more personal interaction (tone of voice, body language, facial expressions) are absent.

Some people use this as an excuse to be asses. Most just trip over it as a trap.

[BOZ]

Oh hell yes. And sometimes that too was a matter of perspective. Lord knows a lot of people have good reason to genuinely hate Izrador, and yet most of us have grudgingly come to enjoy having him around. Fuck, I traded chips with the bastard!

Then there are just as many who wrote him off permanently, or me, or others, based on some silly game we were playing that struck a nerve.

actually, Izzy's an interesting example. i remember before GenCon 2005, the group perception seemed to be that he was more TrollBot than man, but after a number of us met him in person at the con (and found out who he really was) and got to interact with him, there seemed to be an immediate shift in perception. some people took a while to get used to the idea that he might be an OK person outside of his internet political ranting and such, but that change did seem to come overnight.

[Northcott]

actually, Izzy's an interesting example.

He's one of the clearest examples. :)

[PWD]

I'm not saying that the motivation is to hurt people, or be an ass, or even escape consequences. Rather that the lack of consequences makes it easier to exaggerate our own behaviour unless we keep a purposeful watch on that. And worse, even when we do keep an eye on our own behaviour, maintaining some semblance of 'real life' discourse, we can still trip over that line as the myriad of warning signs we depend on in more personal interaction (tone of voice, body language, facial expressions) are absent.

Some people use this as an excuse to be asses. Most just trip over it as a trap.

That I can agree to. For what it's worth, I know when I throw out a blistering post, it's generally aimed at someone who can take it and ideally fire right back. It's one of the dynamics I've enjoyed here, very few are delicate little flowers.

Occasionally I've missed, and occasionally I've ripped on people who hadn't quite cottoned to what the group can be like. Sometimes I've felt remorse, and sometimes I've felt they got what they deserved for not determining the tone of discussion before barging in.

I don't think I've ever attacked with the purpose of genuinely hurting people. Shocking yes. Stunning them long enough to break out of the mind-lock they had on an issue, certainly. Motivating them to snap out of whiny why-me self-pity by not playing the validation game, of course. Mining for the funny, always.

But true, aiming to hurt, picking on the weak type cruelty? I don't think so. Not intentionally. I've come close on occasion while picking on BBB, but that's always at least been intended to kick him out of his depressive shell. I'm not gonna claim it was effective, but he's a ton better these days and something did it, where years of "oh poor billy" did not.

And I think there's the difference. I'd speak in just as blunt and acidic a way to any one of my real life friends if I thought it would help, or if we were just shooting the shit like we do. I can do that because we are friends. Most of you I lump into that same type of interaction, where I know it's not the approach to take at, say, an ENWorld, or with some co-workers. Or here, even, not to the same extent as we did on NTL. I moderate my behavior to the situation and the audience, not out of fear, nor out of intrinsic cruelty, but out of what works.

Others of the "it's just the internet" variety don't ever recognize ramifications, and indulge whatever emotion is pushing them at the moment, and thus you get genuine descents into cruelty.

[Northcott]

Others of the "it's just the internet" variety don't ever recognize ramifications, and indulge whatever emotion is pushing them at the moment, and thus you get genuine descents into cruelty.


Yeah. Those are the types that really get me riled up. Of all the poster types, that's the one I have the least patience for.

[Brynja]

Actually, at this point I have vented my spleen and this seems to be attacting the wrong sort of attention.

I really love Kay's and don't want it becoming home to teh drama. I should have been more aware that posting this where others could might lead to issues.

Unless anyone has any issues, I am asking that this thread be deleted.

[SHARK]

Actually, at this point I have vented my spleen and this seems to be attacting the wrong sort of attention.

I really love Kay's and don't want it becoming home to teh drama. I should have been more aware that posting this where others could might lead to issues.

Unless anyone has any issues, I am asking that this thread be deleted.

Greetings!

Brynja, I don't think you have done *ANYTHING* wrong or inapprorpiate in any way by posting this thread. I like the fact that this message board, and Nothingland before it--was NOT like EN-World, with the fucking grandma bullshit. It's nice where we can have a place where we can be honest--including speaking our minds, and being a bit rough around the edges.

I don't really become friends with people that I have to always keep a formal face on--and it's good to have a place where people can get to know you, accept you, and enjoy you--as you are, honesty and all.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

[Brynja]

Well I just dont want folks getting in an uproar and behaving badly here.

I said it in the last Kay incarnation- i will make it my holy crusade to make life miserable for the person who tries to ruin this place.

I meant it. That said I dont want to court issues either.

[Rappaccini's Daughter]

I don't want to curtail free discourse on my campus. Request denied, cadet! :drillsergeant:

[Dead|Hooker|Disco]

I actually think its refreshing to hear some of the voices in this thread. There have certainly been times (in prior incarnations of the community) in which I have found myself on the wrong side of what I thought was a rather stinging, slightly over the top, insult (often made by the folks participating rather prominently in this thread). Its good to hear that this was probably just as much play as anything else and that I shouldn't take anything personally.

One thing that I struggle with is the fact that folks always seem to suggest how tight people are in this community. That doesn't seem to sync so well with the "screw it...its just the internet, don't take it so seriously." There are definitely (I don't doubt for a moment) people who consider one another friends though they've never met in real life, but I wonder whether the community (not necessarily this incarnation) is held together by something other than friendship...something akin to love of conflict/shitflinging, etc.

In my own, highly personal opinion that is worth exactly what you are paying for it, it would be nice if there was a little less drama and a little less shit flinging and a little more fun and games that don't involve tearing one another down. I'm no huggler, but the constant teardown of others, followed by "its just an act...you should have seen the wink...its just the internet" just seems a little silly.

Hey, what the fuck do I know? I'm just hear to disco. It never died, baby!

[Brynja]

Ma'am, Yes, Ma'am!

[Martin]

Besides, Brynja, this thread became less about the drama and more of a debate on the nature of accountability and responsibility in regards to the Internet. I'd hate to lose that.

[Northcott]

Besides, Brynja, this thread became less about the drama and more of a debate on the nature of accountability and responsibility in regards to the Internet. I'd hate to lose that.

What Mr. Wolfe said.

[Scutisorex Shrewlord]

Well I vow to behave myself. Course, the absence of most of my antagonists makes that a whole lot easier.:p

[Brynja]

Yea I got no issues with you man, but boy oh boy when you get set off by someone else.


lookout!

[PWD]

I actually think its refreshing to hear some of the voices in this thread. There have certainly been times (in prior incarnations of the community) in which I have found myself on the wrong side of what I thought was a rather stinging, slightly over the top, insult (often made by the folks participating rather prominently in this thread). Its good to hear that this was probably just as much play as anything else and that I shouldn't take anything personally.

I don't pay nearly enough attention to posting style subtleties to figure out who you may have been, but I'll tell you right now if it was me, then I was playing, and I'd have hoped you saw it.

[cnath.rm]

Stop flirting with me.

I don't pay nearly enough attention to posting style subtleties to figure out who you may have been, but I'll tell you right now if it was me, then I was playing, and I'd have hoped you saw it.Sometimes it wasn't the easiest to see PWD, thought it could have just been a lack of attention paying on my part.

[PWD]

Sometimes it wasn't the easiest to see PWD, thought it could have just been a lack of attention paying on my part.

I'm gonna go with folks having a touch of good old Dr. Midnight for the most part. I thought I was pretty obvious about it given I'd be ripping people in one thread and being perfectly upbeat and cheery with them in another.

[Scutisorex Shrewlord]

For what it's worth PWD, I never thought you were doing anything other than trying to amuse and have a laugh.

[Martin]

I always thought that you were Natalie Portman.

[cnath.rm]

I'm gonna go with folks having a touch of good old Dr. Midnight for the most part. I thought I was pretty obvious about it given I'd be ripping people in one thread and being perfectly upbeat and cheery with them in another.True, but some of us didn't have the time to check all of the threads, I know I avoided the politics threads for awhile at one point. :)

I always thought that you were Natalie Portman.I think some of the Dr Midnight as you put it, came from being sad at finding out that you weren't really Natalie Portman... :(

[PWD]

It's certainly a risk you take, being perceived as either a genuine ogre, or worse, some little pansy acting tough on the internet. But I think I produced some funny in my day, and I know I entertained the living shit out of myself.

So, come what may, I made my choices. Despite that I've made some good buddies, many of whom I sparred with the most, so it wasn't the worst choice possible. :)

[cnath.rm]

It's certainly a risk you take, being perceived as either a genuine ogre, or worse, some little pansy acting tough on the internet. But I think I produced some funny in my day, and I know I entertained the living shit out of myself.

So, come what may, I made my choices. Despite that I've made some good buddies, many of whom I sparred with the most, so it wasn't the worst choice possible. :)You brought the funny with you many times, so it's all good in my opinion.

[Martin]

So, come what may, I made my choices.

And it's because of that attitude that I would respect you even if I didn't like you.

[Dead|Hooker|Disco]

I think a lot of times its been funny...really fucking funny. There are other times, however, where people simply getting carried away and lines get crossed.

I guess what I am trying to say (and no, I don't have a direct quote) is that one of the saddest things I have heard someone say in the last little while is Topher when he essentially said that he cringed every time someone dogpiled and then proceeded to say, "its ok...thats the Nothingland way."

It saddens me to think that I in no small part, like everyone else, contributed to that. People around here are far too cool and far too creative to spend our community energy doing that kind of shit. Seems like there is far too much funny to go had without doing some of the shit that we have done in the past.

I am about new beginnings and doing something new here. Again, the opinion is worth what you paid for it. :D

[Northcott]

You hear that, guys? The dead hooker's asking for a dogpile!!!


Otherwise the dancing corpse makes a fine point. At some point dogpiles became the greatest source of our entertainment... and not even really funny dogpiles filled with macros and shit-flinging. It was just shit-flinging.

[PWD]

I hear ya.

I think there's a definite difference between what was genuinely "The Nothingland Way" and what was just some sadistic fucks getting off at other people's expenses because they thought they could.

I'm not going to claim sainthood, I know I was perceived differently depending upon who you ask, but to me the Nothingland way was about being able to give and take a punch with a smile and a witty rejoinder, and come back fresh and without a grudge for the next round, not about finding the deepest weaknesses and hammering them relentlessly until you reduced people to atoms, or carrying useless grudges for all eternity. Lord knows I probably got carried away in a couple of dogpiles, but even I was smart enough to recognize the difference most times.

Messageboard Fight Club... but in a good way, if that makes any sense. The hearty brotherhood of combat, and when it was done, we had gone inside, and found what we had to bring. Win or lose, you learned something about yourself.

And sorry if this verges on spoonying, continually trying to relate my own experiences and perspectives, but I'm trying to hopefully provide some context.

Varaj educated us on the mind of a schizophrenic, I'm in some half-assed way giving insight into the mind of a troll/gladiator.

[Martin]

Ever read Scott McCloud's Understand Comics? If you have, you'll understand what I mean when I write "Nothingland was a dark abstraction of Nutkinland."

[PWD]

I have not, but then I've heard comic folks rave about it, so one of these days...

[Northcott]

Ever read Scott McCloud's Understand Comics? If you have, you'll understand what I mean when I write "Nothingland was a dark abstraction of Nutkinland."


I have, and I'm still missing the reference. ;) Mind you, it's also been a decade or so since I last read that...

[Martin]

It's worth a read. I've actually got the series, but I've not really read the latest one.

I'm rethinking my stance on my last statement though. I think that Nothingland was definitely an abstraction, but whether it was a dark abstraction or not is debatable. I don't know. Things change. I sometimes wish that they didn't, but they change nonetheless.

[Northcott]

And sorry if this verges on spoonying, continually trying to relate my own experiences and perspectives, but I'm trying to hopefully provide some context.

I think in this context it's the best way to go about things. After all, speaking from a personal perspective is the most honest we can possibly be in such a situation. It's when we try to speak for others that we start to tread on an unstable surface.

In hindsight, I think the Fight Club mentality -- while I was certainly as guilty of it as anybody else (and far more than others) -- was the problem. Not everybody was there for fight club. To some degree, we respected that. How often did people pick straight-up fights with the more temperate folk like Cat of Ulthar or Mad Hatter? Argued or debated, yes, but rarely (if ever) fought.

But at the first sign of weakness from a temperate person, they could get dopiled, or just savaged by somebody if they were in a foul mood. Our trolls spewed some of the most horrific, dehumanizing shit they could think of. Our flaming folk gutted people mercilessly, and sometimes without discretion. There's no question that we succeeded in driving off people who might otherwise have become contributing members of the community.

[PWD]

Oh, probably. In fact I'm sure of it, because I saw certain folks take great glee in seeing how quickly they could drive off noobs at on point. It got to be a competition. Now granted, people that easily driven off likely wouldn't have lasted, but now we'll never know.

And you bring up Hatter, who while never a flame warrior was never afraid to step into a conversation and make his point, and stand up to anyone, whatever the prevailing winds of an argument. He didn't bring a fight, and he didn't participate, and people mostly respected that. I know early on I didn't, and I took great pains to make peace with him after the fact. Course he also didn't spend his time belly acheing about others having fun slugging it out, which certain folks did.

So I guess it was a wild sort of careening almost-balance. You certainly had outliers in any group you'd care to look at, but for the most part people once they got a feel for what kind of a poster you were gonna be, they left you to it.

I can't think of a time I saw Dawnstar in a fight, or Hatter, or Carrot, or any of a great number of others, and yet they were very much members of the community.

[Martin]

I think too that part of the problem, in our own community at least, that many people stop fighting the fight and start fighting the person. Once that happens, it doesn't matter what the other side has to say, they're wrong, damn it, wrong.

I can think of a very clear example at the moment.

[Ancalagon]

and the need for fight club arose from too much tension stemming from argument in the political forum IMO...

This is all the republicans' fault!!!

[Steampunk]

and the need for fight club arose from too much tension stemming from argument in the political forum IMO...

This is all the republicans' fault!!!

Are you talking about Fight Club?

[Enk]

Did anyone else feel as if at some nebulous point Nutkinland was simply taken over by Bad Fur Day, or was it just me?

[Space Cadet B^3]

I think the community at times lacked empathy for some posters. (Not talking about me here, I was asking for it, I just had to get hit about the head and neck so much that I stopped caring that I hurt.)

I think the hostility, feigned or not, was really confusing to some folks, I had to stop reading all but a couple of forums for a while because the vitriol was so acidic I feared losing control and lowering myself to those levels).

[Martin]

I think the community at times lacked empathy for some posters. (Not talking about me here, I was asking for it, I just had to get hit about the head and neck so much that I stopped caring that I hurt.)

I think the hostility, feigned or not, was really confusing to some folks, I had to stop reading all but a couple of forums for a while because the vitriol was so acidic I feared losing control and lowering myself to those levels).

Brother, sometimes there's such a thing as too much empathy. It's all about balance.

Personally I find that being able to mix the acid with the sweet in life you end up with a tangy drink that is both cool and refreshing.

[Northcott]

Personally I find that being able to mix the acid with the sweet in life you end up with a tangy drink that is both cool and refreshing.

And yet still stings enough to blind your foe temporarily when you throw it in his eyes!

...

...What are you all looking at me like that for? :confused:

Did anyone else feel as if at some nebulous point Nutkinland was simply taken over by Bad Fur Day, or was it just me?

I think that's an excellent way of summing it up. It wasn't a complete takeover, but it was close enough that I think we made some real mistakes as a community in terms of how we dealt with people.

That said, there are some fights that I don't regret in the least.

[Scutisorex Shrewlord]

Did anyone else feel as if at some nebulous point Nutkinland was simply taken over by Bad Fur Day, or was it just me?

No it's definitely not just you. I've lamented that for years.

[PWD]

We've come through it and seem to be able to relate to one another mostly as friends, and in a non-Fight Club way. So far at least, KT2 isn't Nothingland at all.

Most of us don't mind the occasional kick in the teeth and can deal with it when it comes. Many of us also have learned to recognize 'enough' when it comes along. Most of us feel a fierce communal belonging, and protectiveness that isn't immediately apparent to outside attackers.

I think we're in good shape. I have no doubt we've lost some folks, but the core seems strong.

[Limper]

We've come through it and seem to be able to relate to one another mostly as friends, and in a non-Fight Club way. So far at least, KT2 isn't Nothingland at all.

Most of us don't mind the occasional kick in the teeth and can deal with it when it comes. Many of us also have learned to recognize 'enough' when it comes along. Most of us feel a fierce communal belonging, and protectiveness that isn't immediately apparent to outside attackers.

I think we're in good shape. I have no doubt we've lost some folks, but the core seems strong.

You god damn fruit!

[PWD]

You god damn fruit!

You didn't say that when we were cuddling last night, you big poofter.

[Limper]

You didn't say that when we were cuddling last night, you big poofter.

You sound funny talking around the shaft of my cock.

[PWD]

You sound funny talking around the shaft of my cock.

Is that what it is? I had some granola stuck in my teeth and grabbed what I thought was the nearest toothpick at hand.

[Space Cadet B^3]

You sound funny talking around the shaft of my cock.
A little thing like that shouldn't bother you. It's not that big of a deal. :D

[Enk]

You didn't say that when we were cuddling last night, you big poofter.

So who was the big spoon?

[TiQuinn]

Is that what it is? I had some granola stuck in my teeth and grabbed what I thought was the nearest toothpick at hand.


Granola?


Fucking hippie.

[Limper]

Is that what it is? I had some granola stuck in my teeth and grabbed what I thought was the nearest toothpick at hand.

Oh snookums its to late cover up the fact you're a queer.

[Space Cadet B^3]

So who was the big spoon?
What the fork?!

[PWD]

Oh snookums its to late cover up the fact you're a queer.

It's not gay unless your balls touch, GreyOne said so!

[Kastil]

It's not gay unless your balls touch, GreyOne said so!
He tricked you with that one too, eh?

[PWD]

He tricked you with that one too, eh?

Tri... Hey!

[GreyOne]

It's not gay unless your balls touch, GreyOne said so!

That's why I like to bring along a sheet of paper. :)

[Snatch]

Personally I find that being able to mix the acid with the sweet in life you end up with a tangy drink that is both cool and refreshing.

Sort of like pissing in the kool-aid?

[Snatch]

That's why I like to bring along a sheet of paper. :)

You teachers and your paper...:rolleyes:

[GreyOne]

You brought the funny with you many times, so it's all good in my opinion.

As well as syphillus and herpes!

[cnath.rm]

As well as syphillus and herpes!Well that part wasn't as convenient to be sure.

[Goblin Girl]

Does DangerGirl post here? Because if she does she is deserving of some serious rep for not only not rising to the bait, but for being judicious and even-handed in the face of some real fucking callousness.

DangerGirl is pure, unadulterated awesomeness. I love her to pieces.

[Goblin Girl]

You guys are getting a kick out of all this, aren't you?

Damn, with all the drama Zorak generates, you should give him a salary. If it wasn't for him, who would there be to hate?

I've said it before and again... some people take the internet way too fucking seriously.

Time was, I liked and respected you.

[doc]

and the need for fight club arose from too much tension stemming from argument in the political forum IMO...

This is all the republicans' fault!!! Damn Conservative wieners !

Did anyone else feel as if at some nebulous point Nutkinland was simply taken over by Bad Fur Day, or was it just me?
Nope, it seemed all goodness and light to me:rolleyes:

[Utrecht]

At the risk of bringing the debate back about 5 pages - what I never understood - and perhaps it is just how I am wired

But why intentionally pick a fight? Even when posting on message boards, I have taken the old maxim of write the response and then wait 15 minutes before posting/sending it. I would like to think that it has

1) prevented other peoples hackles from getting raised when it was not my intention to do so

2) allowed me to pursue a more reasoned/clear response


Clearly threads/responses (such as granola dick above me) are so over the top that only the most socially deaf person would take it as an insult. But given the fact that most people realize that teh intraweb is an imperfect form of communication - why take the chance?

[BOZ]

DangerGirl is pure, unadulterated awesomeness. I love her to pieces.

i somehow managed to not run into her at all this year. :( and i wish i'd seen more than 2 seconds of you!

[Goblin Girl]

i somehow managed to not run into her at all this year. :( and i wish i'd seen more than 2 seconds of you!

:)

There were several people who I only ever managed to wave to as I ran by. I think I may have packed my schedule too full.

[Phantom Stranger]

So Trainz what about this little gem? Much as I hate to give him more attention . http://www.happyordnance.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=407

Still going to defend him and say it's a joke and the whole "oh you take the internet so seriously?" It takes a lot of effort to be a complete and utter douche bag. I'm glad that your friend was capable of pulling that off.

Sorry if this has been posted already, haven't read every thread.

[Droid101]

So Trainz what about this little gem. Much as I hate to give him more attention . http://www.happyordnance.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=407

Still going to defend him and say it's a joke and the whole "oh you take the internet so seriously?" It takes a lot of effort to be a complete and utter douche bag. I'm glad that your friend was capable of pulling that off.

Sorry if this has been posted already, haven't read every thread.

The sad thing about that thread is, everything Dangergirl said was actually true (at least for the most part). It's pretty clear LoP has low self-esteem, and she's an attention whore. We all knew that for ages.

Zorak is a bigger tool than Knightcrawler.

[Atropine Mama]

So Trainz what about this little gem. Much as I hate to give him more attention . http://www.happyordnance.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=407

Still going to defend him and say it's a joke and the whole "oh you take the internet so seriously?" It takes a lot of effort to be a complete and utter douche bag. I'm glad that your friend was capable of pulling that off.

Sorry if this has been posted already, haven't read every thread.

Boy, Drader sure is a class act. :rolleyes:

Too bad most people remember how things really went down and recognize that he's spewing forth nothing but lies.