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Hatter
05-15-2008, 01:31 PM
link (http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/05/15/same.sex.marriage/index.html)

California ban on same-sex marriage struck down

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- In a much-anticipated ruling issued Thursday, the California Supreme Court struck down the state's ban on same-sex marriage as unconstitutional.

Several gay and lesbian couples, along with the city of San Francisco and gay rights groups, sued to overturn state laws allowing only marriages between a man and a woman.

"There can be no doubt that extending the designation of marriage to same-sex couples, rather than denying it to all couples, is the equal protection remedy that is most consistent with our state's general legislative policy and preference," said the 120-page ruling.

It said that the state law's language "limiting the designation of marriage to a 'union between a man and a woman' is unconstitutional, and that the remaining statutory language must be understood as making the designation of marriage available to both opposite-sex and same-sex couples."

With the ruling, California becomes the second state to allow same-sex couples to legally wed. Massachusetts adopted the practice in 2004, and couples don't need to be state residents to wed there.

Vermont, New Jersey, New Hampshire and Connecticut permit civil unions, while California has a domestic-partner registration law. More than a dozen other states give gay couples some legal rights.

Seven other jurisdictions around the world have legalized same-sex marriage: Belgium, Netherlands, Spain, South Africa and the Canadian provinces of British Columbia, Ontario, and Quebec.

San Francisco officials in 2004 allowed same-sex couples in the city to wed, prompting a flood of applicants crowding the city hall clerk's office. The first couple to wed then was 80-year-old Phyllis Lyon and 83-year-old Dorothy Martin, lovers for 50 years.

"We have a right just like anyone else to get married to the person we want to get married to," Lyon said at the time.

One issue before the justices was whether San Francisco's laws carried legal weight when the rest of the state banned same-sex marriages. Gay rights advocates argued the state was violating their civil rights by limiting marriage to opposite-sex couples. The state law in question is the Defense of Marriage Act, Proposition 22.

Oral arguments in the case in March lasted more than three hours, a sign of the political and legal issues at stake. Six cases were consolidated.

Groups saying they were promoting a pro-family agenda had vowed to fight a statewide law allowing same-sex marriage.

"The government should promote and encourage strong families," said Glen Lavy of the Alliance Defense Fund. "The voters realize that defining marriage as one man and one woman is important because the government should not, by design, deny a child both a mother and father."

An appeal to the U.S. Supreme Court is likely. The federal high court has never addressed the question of same-sex marriage.

Interesting times. I hope this works out. I'd love to get married someday and that day seems closer.

FeatsofClay
05-15-2008, 01:32 PM
I believe our courts and lawmakers will eventually realize that marriage is a right and you need a real reason to remove a persons right.

Singularity
05-15-2008, 04:36 PM
The pro-ban people are now going to try to amend the California constitution to prevent gay marriage, which will then make this ruling irrelevant.

Hatter
05-15-2008, 04:50 PM
The pro-ban people are now going to try to amend the California constitution to prevent gay marriage, which will then make this ruling irrelevant.

I suspect they'll fail, though I've been disappointed before.

Singularity
05-15-2008, 05:12 PM
I suspect they'll fail, though I've been disappointed before.

Too many Jeezus freaks out there.

Tetsubo
05-17-2008, 08:06 AM
Welcome California to the 21st Century.

I don't think an amendment will pass however. This is the start. The tide is turning. Just as the laws preventing interracial marriage are gone, so will the laws restricting marriage to persons of the opposite gender.

Eliezer
05-19-2008, 02:17 PM
The pro-ban people are now going to try to amend the California constitution to prevent gay marriage, which will then make this ruling irrelevant.

Parts of state constitutions can be invalidated as unconstitutional under the U.S. constitution. 14th amendment was used to invalidate 2 assembly representation schemes that worked on the state level similar to the Senate on the Federal level. (That being that state assembly "senators" had to be proportionally represented just like the representatives.)

So in effect, a California constitutional ban could be invalidated by the Federal court system.

Probable best case scenario: California passes an insanely dumb constitutional amendment and gets it struck down by the Federal court in San Francisco. An appeal is made to Supreme Court and Supreme Court upholds San Francisco court decision and effectively does a Roe v Wade on same sex marriage legalizing it for the whole nation.

Teve
05-19-2008, 06:56 PM
An appeal is made to Supreme Court and Supreme Court upholds San Francisco court decision and effectively does a Roe v Wade on same sex marriage legalizing it for the whole nation.

That would be nice, the KS and other constitutional amendments could be voided.... since I don't see such a fight happening here.

Ancalagon
05-19-2008, 07:16 PM
I hope that you folks can catch up to Canada... nothing "bad" has happened over here because of gay marriage.

Hatter
05-19-2008, 07:37 PM
Parts of state constitutions can be invalidated as unconstitutional under the U.S. constitution. 14th amendment was used to invalidate 2 assembly representation schemes that worked on the state level similar to the Senate on the Federal level. (That being that state assembly "senators" had to be proportionally represented just like the representatives.)

So in effect, a California constitutional ban could be invalidated by the Federal court system.

Probable best case scenario: California passes an insanely dumb constitutional amendment and gets it struck down by the Federal court in San Francisco. An appeal is made to Supreme Court and Supreme Court upholds San Francisco court decision and effectively does a Roe v Wade on same sex marriage legalizing it for the whole nation.
This scenario would pretty much depend on a democrat becoming the next president since new appointments are likely in the next term and it's unlikely that McCain will appoint liberal leaning justices (even if he himself is socially moderate).

Pigs in Space
05-19-2008, 07:49 PM
I hope that you folks can catch up to Canada... nothing "bad" has happened over here because of gay marriage.

Oh yeah?

What about the morality of the people? This is a slippery slope with you Canadians. Just look at your Socialized health, international reputation, living standards and lack of crime.

Eliezer
05-20-2008, 01:44 PM
This scenario would pretty much depend on a democrat becoming the next president since new appointments are likely in the next term and it's unlikely that McCain will appoint liberal leaning justices (even if he himself is socially moderate).

It'd be casual for McCain to appoint judges that are moderate and mainstream in their views if the Democrats maintain control of the Senate.

Either way, if the situation is ended by judicial fiat it will become just as divisive as Roe v. Wade.

Teve
05-20-2008, 05:44 PM
Oh yeah?

What about the morality of the people? This is a slippery slope with you Canadians. Just look at your Socialized health, international reputation, living standards and lack of crime.

http://www.sfu.ca/~mauser/papers/LondonTower2003/Fig12CDNcrimes.xls.pdf

I've found lots of statistics on crime rates US v.s. Canada, but this is the one I like best, because I'm American, and Canada's gun laws annoy me (but only when I have to plan a trip THROUGH Canada) :D

(don't tell anyone most statistics gave Canada the better #'s :shock: )

Singularity
05-20-2008, 05:54 PM
http://www.sfu.ca/~mauser/papers/LondonTower2003/Fig12CDNcrimes.xls.pdf

I've found lots of statistics on crime rates US v.s. Canada, but this is the one I like best, because I'm American, and Canada's gun laws annoy me (but only when I have to plan a trip THROUGH Canada) :D

(don't tell anyone most statistics gave Canada the better #'s :shock: )

See? There's a reason they call them peacekeepers!

doc
05-20-2008, 06:00 PM
Hear the Ellen DeGenerate is going to marry her GF in a few days.

Let them marry whoever they want as long as thier not related by bllod, of age and the same spiecies

Dacke
05-23-2008, 05:49 PM
Let them marry whoever they want as long as thier not related by bllod, of age and the same spiecies
What do you have against Spock?